ØF Lawyer vs. Lauren Chen HEATED DEBATE! | Dating Talk #92

Date: 2023-08-21

Duration: 4h 04m

Guests

Brian Atlas

JJasmine Jafar >

MMadison (DT94)>

EEmily Rainey (DT92)>

Identified Speakers

SPEAKER_00TTS Reader(audience)

SPEAKER_01Emily Rainey(guest)

SPEAKER_02Shia(guest)

SPEAKER_03Haley(guest)

SPEAKER_04Jasmine Jafar(guest)

SPEAKER_06Lauren Chen(guest)

SPEAKER_07Madison(guest)

SPEAKER_08Brian Atlas(host)

Key Moments

QuoteJasmine Jafar introduces herself as 28yo OnlyFans creator AND licensed attorney, earning low-to-mid six figures per month on OnlyFans vs six-figure annual salary as attorney.

“my name is Jasmine Jafar I'm 28 and I am an only fans creator and a licensed attorney... only fans is six figures a month”

QuoteLauren Chen introduces herself as 29yo TPUSA contributor and Blaze TV host/YouTuber.

“my name is Lauren I am 29 and a TPUSA contributor as well as a Blaze TV host and YouTuber”

QuoteJasmine describes quitting her law firm job for OnlyFans as a "no-brainer" — more time, money, happiness, and freedom.

“when I saw that it could definitely be a career for me it was like a no-brainer so more time money happiness freedom”

QuoteJasmine describes father's ultimatum to stop OnlyFans; she refused for the first time in her life. Family didn't speak for months before reconciling.

“he calls me and he's like you know what this is a terrible thing... and that was the first time in my life that I was just like no”

QuoteEmily Rainey arrives late (~20 min in) and introduces herself as 26yo social media and OnlyFans creator, in a 4-year relationship.

“yes hi I'm Emily Rainey I'm 26 and I do social media and only fans... I'm in a relationship”

ControversyJasmine Jafar vs Brian Atlas (and Lauren Chen) heated debate on mandatory selective service / draft. Jasmine argues draft is not a live issue in 2023. Brian calls her dismissive of men's concerns. Jasmine muted twice via viewer donations during this debate.

“the biggest issue for a man in 2023 right now is that he had to spend 10 minutes registering for something that is very likely to not come to fruition”

OtherViewer pays $500 to trigger Jasmine's microphone mute during draft debate.

“$500 to I think that does trigger a mute that's fine I'm tired of this issue anyway”

OtherBrian Atlas mutes Jasmine for 10 minutes after TTS chat insults her credibility as a lawyer.

“Nick it's a 10-minute mute on number nine is it all right sorry Jasmine”

QuoteAfter being unmuted, Jasmine jokes: someone can pay another $500 and she would be quiet for that.

“I'm back oh God I'm sorry I'm sorry guys someone can pay you another 500 I'd be quiet for that”

QuoteLauren Chen explains she changed her YouTube handle from "Roaming Millennial" to her real name because older conservatives at in-person events were confused by the screen name.

“I started doing in-person events and with a lot of older people and they were really weirded out by a screen name they did not understand”

ControversyExtended debate between Jasmine and Brian on promiscuity statistics (GSS data). Jasmine argues access to hookup culture does not translate to behavior. Brian argues women are more promiscuous by capability. Jasmine dissects his logic: missing bridging premise.

“you're missing the middle so premise two would have to be women are acting on this accessibility therefore women are more promiscuous you don't have that second premise”

QuoteHaley reveals her husband is a dedicated Eve Online player with spreadsheets, fleet meetings, and post-fleet debriefs.

“my husband is a pretty dedicated Eve player... he has spreadsheets out and they have meetings about it and then like post fleet meetings”

Topics Discussed

Introductions & Show Announcements

Brian opens from Santa Barbara, CA. Recovering from illness. Hurricane and earthquake (5.5) in area; 8 guests flaked. Guests introduce themselves: Jasmine Jafar (28yo OnlyFans/attorney), Shia (26yo model/hotel), Haley (20yo flight instructor/UCSB), Lauren Chen (29yo Blaze TV/TPUSA). Emily Rainey (26yo OnlyFans/social media) joins ~24min in. Politics round: Jasmine = libertarian-left, Shia = apolitical, Haley = fairly progressive-left, Lauren Chen = right-wing/conservative, Madison = moderate/slightly right-leaning.

OnlyFans & Adult Content

Extended discussion of Jasmine's career pivot from attorney to OnlyFans (6-figure monthly income vs 6-figure annual as lawyer). Family background: Iranian immigrant parents, both sister and mom are lawyers. Parents initially disowned her for months before reconciling. Don't-ask-don't-tell policy with family now. Lauren Chen argues adult content not healthy for society; wants stricter age restrictions on platforms. Shia and Emily also do OnlyFans. Discussion of impact on future relationships (Jasmine says it won't affect her dating prospects with liberal men).

Political Leanings & Values Alignment in Dating

Brian asks panel about political leanings and whether they matter in dating. Jasmine: only dates liberal men; would not date conservative. Lauren Chen: right-wing/conservative, shares values with conservative husband. Haley: fairly progressive-left. Madison: moderate/slightly right-leaning. Jasmine argues politics reflect values alignment.

Feminist Debate: Workforce, Gender Roles, and Equality

Extended debate primarily between Jasmine Jafar and Lauren Chen with Brian moderating. Topics: women in workforce, happiness studies (DINKs vs parents), loneliness epidemic, social media's role in disconnection. Jasmine argues correlation/causation issues in blaming women's workforce participation for loneliness. Lauren and Brian argue meaningful connections have declined.

Male Selective Service / Draft Debate

Debate on whether women should register for the draft. Jasmine argues draft is not a relevant issue in 2023 and would abolish it entirely. Brian argues men's mandatory selective service registration is a real legal burden (felony + federal benefit disqualification for failure to register). Lauren Chen proposes service guaranteeing citizenship model (Starship Troopers-style). Chat suggests mandatory 2-year service for all. Discussion of Ukraine as example of wartime male conscription. Jasmine muted twice via viewer donations during this segment.

Reproductive Rights & Child Support

Discussion of men's reproductive rights (or lack thereof). Jasmine argues biology explains the asymmetry (child in woman's body). Brian argues legal paternal surrender and financial obligations post-birth are inequitable. Discussion of Roe v. Wade reversal. Lauren Chen raises mandatory paternity testing proposal and child support transparency. Panel generally agrees child support should be tracked/dedicated to child.

Male Emotional Vulnerability

Panel asked if men crying or being emotional would change romantic feelings. Emily: loves emotional men, boyfriend is large man who cries (makes her fall more in love). Haley: vulnerability makes her feel she created safe space; net positive. Lauren Chen: attractive if contrasted with confidence; dislikes men who cry regularly. Shia: uncomfortable with excessive emotion from anyone. Brian's World of Warcraft hypothetical: man crying over losing loot roll in-game. Lauren notes husband rages about Eve Online with spreadsheets and post-fleet meetings.

Dating Norms: Who Pays, Who Asks

Round-table discussion on first date bill splitting. Jasmine: person who asks should pay (expects man to pay if he asked her; she would pay if she asked a man). Shia: fine splitting separately. Emily: would not object and would sometimes offer to pay whole bill. Lauren Chen: fine splitting, did pay for dates when single. Madison: would love man to pay but fine either way. Brian argues men are default initiators and therefore bear both asking and paying burdens — inconsistency with Jasmine's egalitarian positions elsewhere.

Attractiveness Ratings & Self-Assessment

Discussion triggered by Brian on utility of 1-10 scale. Jasmine argues scale is juvenile and subjective (cites cultural variations in beauty standards, Statue of Aphrodite). Brian argues self-awareness is important especially for women to avoid delusional dating expectations. Lauren argues someone out there will find you beautiful but reality-checking matters. Emily says her self-assessment fluctuates day to day. Haley notes uniqueness of individual preferences.

Body Count, Promiscuity Stats, and Pair Bonding

Extended debate on body count and promiscuity. Jasmine argues lifetime body count does not correlate with marriage likelihood (cites studies). Brian disputes using 2018 GSS data showing 1-in-3 men under 30 sexless vs 1-in-6 women. Jasmine counters with 2021/2022 GSS data showing women more sexless. Brian argues women have more access to hookup culture therefore are more promiscuous by capability; Jasmine disputes that access translates to behavior. Lauren Chen argues correlation between body count and pair bonding risk. Debate on whether hookup culture is overrepresented in manosphere discourse.

Firearms Ownership in a Partner

Final round question: would you date a man who legally owns a firearm? Jasmine: yes, no issue. Emily: yes, provides security. Lauren Chen: yes, husband has several. Haley: context-dependent; hesitant about urban setting but could accept. Madison: fine. Brian's home-invasion scenario sparks extended discussion with Haley defending non-firearm deterrence options. Lauren Chen notes UK/US difference in home-invasion rates attributed to firearm ownership.

Transcript

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Haleyall kinds of different stuff and you know I think the basis of saying oh women are just worst Pilots naturally and I would want a mail if there was the plane was crashing I think that really just stems from ignorance like they

Haleydon't understand that the aviation industry at this point is so standardized that everyone is taking the exact same exams and everyone it's very unbiased um you like if your skills and

Haleyyour knowledge isn't up to par that's going to be called out and that's what makes gen Aviation overall especially

Brian AtlasAirlines so safe at this point in time look I don't know what the truth is but couldn't you argue

Brian Atlasthat that in stressful situations that temperamentally generally speaking men

Jasmine Jafardo have some sort of better stress resilience no cuz I think there are a ton of women like I said it could be true on average that are better than men in those situations so to ever look at a person and use broad generalizations to

Jasmine Jafarbe like you're a woman therefore you have this temperament that's that indicates a lack of critical thinking in my opinion that's just you being like okay I'm going to put you in this category I'm going to put you in this category I'm put you in this C

Jasmine Jafarespecially on in areas like this where there is so much overlap it's it's false like she just said they have a standardized test get and she has to do the same thing every other man has to do

TTS Readerin order to be a pilot Alvin Sam donated $99 what these women fail to understand is that male privilege comes with an enormous responsibility to produce

TTS Readerperform and provide men face an enormous burden of performance that rewards them this privilege women want equality without the responsibility responsibility

Jasmine Jafarresponsibility it's a new word I actually think that this is an area where I I think men are struggling is because men and I think the manosphere space just pushes them back more because they're like your only role

Jasmine Jafaris in being the bread winner and they're trying to kind of turn the clock back on gender equality which is just not going to happen so we need to have a new vision for men coming forward where they're worth in their value is more than them just being an ATM machine and

Jasmine Jafarthese postapocalyptic circumstances where a plane is crashing or you're hanging off a cliff I get that all the time if you're hanging off a cliff don't you want a man I'm like I don't I go to like Trader Joe's why am I going to be hanging off a cliff so like I think that for men a lot of them don't have this

Jasmine Jafarvision of masculinity going forward they have this narrow distorted view that's becoming less and less like needed in today's society because now almost half of households we have women making just as much if not more than men so if your

Jasmine Jafaronly rol your identity is embedded and how much money you make and your role as a bread winner yeah this is one of part of the reason men are struggling well I think the the reason why men are struggling right now is because men more so than women they need to be needed

Lauren Chenthey need to have a very specific purpose a dragon they can slay something they can conquer and be needed by the community and I don't like I don't think it's necessarily accurate to say that the reason why men are struggling now is

Lauren Chenthat like oh it's because that they're thinking like this I think the reason why they're struggling is because a lot of men don't have an Avenue that's productive where they can put that effort in right I mean so many men they're disenfranchised they don't feel like uh women need them they don't feel

Lauren Chenlike the workforce needs them they're not doing well in school and I think that kind of contributes to that and I think if we want to help them obviously we should see anybody as more than an ATM or you know bread winner and I think you know simultaneously telling men like

Lauren Chensome people in the manosphere do like women are only going to want you if you make like six figures or blah BL it's demoralizing because for the majority of men it's not going to happen but I I I think we need to find a way where we can

TTS Readerwork with men's kind of that drive to be needed I think it's going to be more more useful rather than trying to change it entires are

TTS Reader99 but only because men aren't competing for jobs but for actual love women aren't we have to achieve much higher

TTS Readercompetence to attract women no one is better it's 100% incentives until women change what they're attracted to men will always outperform okay I want to respond to her really quick if I could

Jasmine Jafarsure so I I agree with you but I think that's why we need to expand what is considered a man's role in society so for instance there's been studies done where women where do you get your meaning in life and before before they start entering the workforce they got it

Jasmine Jafarentirely in the home and now you see women just as much as men can get their meaning in the workforce but for men they're not getting their meaning from being at home with their kids if they want to be a stay-at-home dad they're not finding meaning in that right now

Jasmine Jafarpartly because Society still largely believes where they've done studies where they're like can you still be a good mother now if you're working and most Americans say yes but we still have these stereotypes for men like no in order to be a good man you need to be

Jasmine Jafarthe bread winner when I think there are more roles that men can fill in society and find their meaning outside of just being a bread winner I mean I definitely wouldn't want to downplay the like importance of a

Lauren Chenfather being a father like I've I've seen some people say that oh yeah men don't need to be around after the birth because there's nothing for them to do okay that's absolutely not true like if you are a dad and you your wife has a

Lauren Chennewborn you 100% should be there to help um so I definitely don't agree with like that mentality but and I I don't think I disagree with you entirely there it's just I I think we need to kind of be

Lauren Chenable to lean into the way that men thinks um that that would probably be a lot easier than just be like we I I feel like that type of thinking it's almost trying to feminize men saying that you

Lauren Chenas a man you just need to reevaluate how you're thinking because we as women have changed society and I don't think that's necessarily fair for the men who have been left behind I don't think men need to rewire their thinking I think we all do I don't think it's just men I think

Jasmine Jafaras a culture as a society we've done so many things to push women forward and I think that's been great we've narrowed the gap on many things like education but I think like you're right we've left Men Behind by still saying Your Role is a breadwinner when now if half of almost

Jasmine Jafarhalf of us uh families in the US the woman is making as much or more now these men are like okay well I guess my only role in this in family is to be a breadwinner and I'm saying no that's not your only role that's not the only thing

Jasmine Jafaryou're good for as a man you're you're just as much of a of a full multifaceted person as women are so women get praised for doing both I think men should also get praised for doing both men should be praised for their Ro as of a father and

Brian Atlasyou don't disagree with that so I don't think we're really disagreeing too much here well they've definitely I've definitely heard that a lot of women are

Brian Atlasfinding men to be not economically attractive I've seen these headlines of so we're getting into hypergamy is that

Brian Atlaswhere we're going well I suppose but but I mean if we are going to have women who are fighting to be equal in the

Brian Atlasworkplace and successful and making their own money then correspondingly there's going to have to be women that are prepared to date men who are making less money than them well

Jasmine Jafarthey are so we we it's been recent that but are they happy I don't think they are well you think or because hypergamy is on the decline there's a lot of studies showing this that now more and it's actually on the incline no maybe

Jasmine Jafarwe're looking at different can I get a laptop and we can we're definitely looking at definitely on the decline in especially they looked at like 27 countries including like European countries and yeah women are now okay

Jasmine Jafarmore and more okay with in general people like to date across like it's a sort a sort of meeting people like to dat generally date across socioeconomic status across IQ across education across even attractiveness well there's actually there's a difference women like

Jasmine Jafarto date across and up and men date across and down men are more likely to date down especially on certain things like how much money they make but that that's changing but still in general in general people tend to it's the similar

Jasmine Jafarit's attraction similarity hypothesis is one of the most researched uh theories in the attra psychology of Attraction it's very people generally like lawyers tend to date other lawyers people tend to date people um also because of the

Jasmine Jafarproximity aspect of it that's also a big part of Attraction but this idea especially if you look at history like hypergamy hasn't in general most people were dating across like the status of their husband even back in the day was

Jasmine Jafarsimilar to that of their father like you can find more instances of men dating down than women but in general that's not the general Trend and it never has been what's not the general Trend that

Jasmine Jafarpeople that women are just dating way above their level in general people are in general people are dating across that's what we're seeing now if there's one gender that's more likely to date

Jasmine Jafardown it is men and that's remains true but in general this thing that women are are in General trying to go for someone way above them in status in general that's not how people mate and that's

Jasmine Jafarnot been shown in history or anything but I guess AB it absolutely has been shown that what in history that what well this is what I mean if you look at if you look at I wish I could pull up my studies if you look at overall history

Jasmine Jafarlike I just said even back in the day when gender roles were more stringent than they are now women typically their husband had the same social status as their father like people people

Jasmine Jafargenerally families I can even say like even in modern society in like um where my family's from in Iran you tend to date and marry people like your family and their family okay are they from a good family okay we're from a good

Jasmine Jafarfamily we're educated they're educated our son and our daughter should be together it's not like hey Mom and Dad I these are these make great Disney movies where it's like hey I found the the uh waitress or she's scrubbing my floor

Lauren ChenCinderella it can happen but that's not the norm Cinderella isn't the norm but I guess the go go well I guess the problem that a lot of women are facing and i' I've seen articles about this too is that not only

Lauren Chenare they you know not being picked up by the millionaire or the billionaire or anything like that but they're even having trouble finding men who are of their same socioeconomic status so the question for some women is not just oh am I going to date someone across

Jasmine Jafarinstead of up it's am I willing to date someone down so interestingly people in the top 20% of education and socioeconomic status they're not their marriage rates are the same they're not having any issue with this this seems to

Jasmine Jafarbe more of an you lower down which would be kind of the opposite of what people say because they're like oh if you're higher up if you're more educated if you're a lawyer you're eliminating so many options it's harder for you to date female lawyers are not having issues getting married the stats bear that out

Jasmine Jafarand I can even just say anecdotally well I mean it's true that the more educated a woman is the less likely she is to get married and the less likely she is to have children that's not true at all so we can look that up that's actually that's been steady so the marriage rate for women in the top 20% college

TTS Readereducated women especially if they have higher education has remained steady I didn't say it wasn't comp jine the fallacy with your argument is that for couples to date AC cross the

TTS Readerman must be a higher earn attorney's dating is not the same as McDonald's workers dating for lateral dating to happen the man must already be successful so do McDonald's workers not

Jasmine Jafarhave wives and relationships is it only successful men no when we look across even for having sex when we look across income it's not that rich people are having so much more sex than poor people in fact poor people are reproducing more we don't see this big change with BMI

Jasmine Jafarlike it's not just the fit men that are having a ton of sex it's not just the tall men that are having a ton of sex every like people across all ranges when it comes to any of these characteristics are having sex and our our mating now

Jasmine Jafarlike I've said the marriage rate has gone gone down for um people of lower socioeconomic status when it's remained the same and even kind of gone up for people of higher socioeconomic status you're so full of well I mean go

Lauren Chenahead continue with your uh why am I full of Brian I'll I'll address it okay I mean it's it's hard because we're we're saying different things and there's probably a study to back up each

TTS Readersorry Martin donated $100 L ho I'm an attorney but snow one of the largest firms in the world licensed in TN and M left to start

TTS Readerconstruction Coes now valued at nine figures you your midface and media like you are utterly unimpressive your ancestors sacrificed for nothing okay I'm going to say I doubt this is a

Jasmine Jafarlawyer me and my lawyer friends were actually just having a conversation about this lawyers don't talk like this like if there's a conservative lawyer they're more like her they're going to be like you know wanting to date like Ben Shir and stuff they don't talk like this they'd have unless he was just like

Jasmine Jafara secret incel like in his in his closet that got into some fourth tier law school but that is not how lawyers speak no Wy coyote5 donated

TTS Reader$99 as a controller I can confirm your gender has nothing to do with how well you can fly I've had male and female pilots who have flown for 30 plus years

TTS Readerthat made me say WTF are you doing your P1 me off equally LOL kidding kinda okay you guys piss me off just as much oh

Brian Atlasokay all right little most of the time we we love you though we appreciate you I I have seen marquavius Martin's bonafides is that how you say it Bona

Jasmine Jafarbonafides I've never bonafides he's a Mena member apparently he's an attorney I mean that's a I am I'm as weird of an attorney as you can get and that would be even weirder than me like

Jasmine JafarI said there is there is the Federalist Society in every law school there are very similar to her she wouldn't write a comment like that she just doesn't he could he could disagree with me but the manner in which you disagree with me I think more people educated people

Jasmine Jafargenerally like I said aren't online like you 304 mid like they just don't even they don't they don't even know about this world like they just aren't doing this he must be some deep incel if he's

Jasmine Jafarokay now you're sorry I'm just being that's what I think all right well yeah the they've been uh a little mean I think me he just no

Jasmine Jafarno no they've been mean to you so oh that's fine yeah she's definely got thick skin yeah no I this doesn't bother me at all you guys can keep it coming give Brian the money it's all good all I make my money you make your money off

Jasmine Jafaryou have it folks there you have it although a better use of your money is my only fans but erroneous I got distracted mid comment I idea what I was going to

Lauren Chensay yeah yeah uh do you recall what we were talking about uh oh I I I think with the education and marriage rates so I don't know if you've read the bell curve but one of the things that Charles

Lauren ChenMurray talks about is how obviously IQ and especially higher education is correlated and they do find that consistently women who are like they they have more advanced degrees more years in school they are less likely to

Lauren Chenget married than women who are less educated and who kind of proportionately obviously have lower IQs and it's almost it's a problem that he's writing about because we almost have a sort of a dysgenic going on we all one who did the race in IQ too right

TTS ReaderCharles jasine going example to argue that hypergamy ising are the topers and topers in general are a small percentage of the

Jasmine Jafarpopulation your generalization is extremely flawed because of this so I just I I guess yes I understand understand that that's a that's I what I was arguing when I said that was about the top percentages of society but in

Jasmine Jafargeneral people do data cross so McDonald's workers are more likely to date someone else in the fast food industry they're not just not dating and I was saying lawyers because that's the only experience I've had really outside

Jasmine Jafarof only fans they tend to date and marry other lawyers like 18 Couples from my law school got married this is just that's just how people normally May and lawyers do on average and and marry

Jasmine Jafarother lawyers more than they marry women in any other profession well you mentioned proximity that would make sense because they it's not just a shared commonality proximity is one thing but like for instance you hear this in the manosphere a lot like oh men

Jasmine Jafardon't care they'll marry a girl out of CVS or a hot girl off Instagram they will no but maybe in podcast like world and whatever but in but lawyers in general like if I was hanging out with a

TTS Readergroup of my friends lawyer friends and cus donated $150 Brian you should get it there and at on your show he lives in La has a

TTS Readerfollowing would School these girls and I'm pretty sure he can bring girls onto the show too okay I'll uh thank you very much for your uh donation appreciate it I'll check him out on uh Instagram the

Jasmine Jafarreal Notch thank you man as I was saying you won't see somebody bring like oh I just I'm bringing my new girlfriend along we'd be like great and then she'd come and he's like oh this is this 18-year-old hot cheick I met off Instagram we'd be like it's just so not a thing like they're usually and they

Jasmine Jafardon't have to be other lawyers they could be working with special needs kids whatever but they're not bagging the hot 18-year-old from CVS at least educated populations don't generally do that unless the only exception I would say is

Jasmine Jafarif they're really religious like if they're Mormons like there was a ton of Mormons in my law school and they will marry like a homemaker and whatever they'll they'll do that but they they won't marry hot Instagram girls or girls

Brian Atlasthat work at Taco Bell it's just not but but do you think men are particularly preoccupied with in terms of something being an attraction trigger do you think men are particularly attracted to a woman's success or her money uh you're

Jasmine Jafargoing to hate me but new studies do indicate they do especially even bus who's like the Mana spere evolutionary psychologist God has found this uh the work of Karin uh Karin has showed that women they've they've done studies now where they put like on dating apps

Jasmine Jafarthey've taken like millions of users and they'll put a face for both men and women and then income and they find both genders tend to find people more attractive when they had more higher income so you could look this up Karen's the I haven't seen that particular study

Jasmine Jafarbut yeah because you've only seen the studies that you like and I've seen your studies and my studies because I had to know yours to be able to check on it so you you think that I still think men

Jasmine Jafarcare less than women care okay but I do think but I think things are changing and men are starting to care more and more as we're moving towards more of an egalitarian society M kt7 donated

TTS Reader$100 you're a lawyer that makes Bank cof of and probably hooks up with high quality men then what do you know about the average person working the average job you have no clue how us normal folks

Jasmine Jafarlive incorrect you which is not surprising are you a n normal

Jasmine Jafarfolk am I supposed to respond to a question oh okay um I I mean I'm not a normal folk and I admit that so probably like especially if I talk about my personal experiences I'm in a bubble and

Jasmine JafarI was definitely in a bubble when it comes to Academia that's why I'm shocked at how many of people in this sphere don't have basic English skills I can't even use like this is stuff we learned in fifth grade so I was very oblivious

Jasmine Jafarto this and I will admit that however so I'm not I mean yeah but I however a lot of the stuff I'm talking about I've researched this stuff a lot because I didn't want to just come on here and be one of these girls like I feel like this show is just like what do you think I don't know what do you think well

Jasmine Jafarthere's data on this and that's a better indicator than what we all think based off our personal experiences because that could be biased like for me I'm around being a certain type of person person that knows how to spell and read and write and now most of the internet

Lauren ChenI'm around doesn't well I mean to get back to the income with dating issue I could totally believe that maybe nowadays men are starting to be like okay if we're going to need two incomes maybe it's good that she's able to make

Lauren Chenmoney but I think there's also still studies out there that show that men are actually less attracted to women if she makes more than them after a certain point the money the success that the woman has can actually be repellent to at least some men yes um that's true

Jasmine Jafarthat's true that some men do still feel feel that way and even some women feel that way and that's one of the things I think we should change as a culture that they they don't like making more than their than their spouse and Men also can feel emasculated by that that is one of

Jasmine Jafarthe things I think we should change I don't think it should be a big deal it's just about what works for you and your family okay you said a lot of stuff

Brian Atlasum so I haven't seen the studies that you're referencing but this idea we could pull them up which one huh which one I don't know but you're you're

Jasmine Jafarasserting that men care deeply about a woman's success or I didn't say deeply I said that they're showing now that men do men overall do care about income and that's

Jasmine Jafarchanging because much less than women care less than women yes but that's a shift we're seeing as Society is changing men of the offender donated $99 Jasmine no rational person would

Jasmine Jafarwant to hire a lawyer that only cares about her own interests uh yeah I don't want to get hired by a firm if I did I wouldn't have quit to do only they really like you Jasmine they're big fans

Jasmine Jafarof you big fans thank you bend appr only fans probably blowing up right now but you do want to get back into the law eventually is that correct uh I don't I probably won't need to but yes if I do

Jasmine Jafarif I do ever get back into it I I want to advocate for sex workers or work for like a nonprofit do that kind of work I don't really ever want to use it to make an income anymore let me get a couple chats here uh Logan Ria Brian hope all

Brian Atlasis well sounds a little under the weather better be taking a well-deserved break time to time love the podcast currently trying to watch all of them to get caught up Madison hit me up if things fall through with Frankie you a cutie question

Haleymark uh you're never going to get hit up I'm sorry oh things are never going to fall through can you read this one flight girl uh it's is not ignorance

Haleyyou miss simple statistics you are being selected from a smaller pool of applicants by definition oh oh Matthew M donated

TTS Reader$99 Jasmine is correct same as Destiny stated on your podcast before on average men and women date and marry within their Social Circles and with the rise

Jasmine Jafarof equal rights education and job opportunity for women hypergamy is declining love you boo Balor yeah I just want to say everyone that's in my dance like using Destiny statistics I think me and Destiny just looked up the same

Jasmine Jafarand these are just the statistics I don't think it's minor statistics I think we're just two individuals that wanted to do the proper research and look at the actual facts unlike you know some people like I don't think anyone is saying it's inaccurate to say that

Lauren Chenpeople tend to marry within the same socio EC you're not saying it but a lot of the manosphere does oh yeah cuz I mean like you said proximity and obviously like they just social differences which isn't necessarily a good thing because that's kind of classes but it's just the way it is but

Lauren ChenI think we still can't ignore the the fact that you know if you're writing a dating profile women and I don't think even you deny this women are going to care a lot more about what a man's job and income is than the reverse that's true but I think that's shifting and we

Jasmine Jafarhave evidence that that's shifting and it's starting to become that men are starting to care as much because of just the reality of the society we live in so we've it's still relatively recent that women have been um in in the in the

Brian Atlasworkforce so the shift is going to happen slowly over time and we're seeing it shift well I disagree but let me let me pull this one up really quick we were in the middle of reading it um I'll pull it

Haleyone up again um let's see by definition the men are facing fiercer competition passing the minimal standards make you confident but not the best yeah I agree with that

HaleyI think each individual um you know that does not make you the best bu by being able to pass standards but that's why it's important that there's people

TTS Readermy it's crazy tonight all right thank you guys Brian 100% get it there anat on next red Bill guy to blow and you two would create epic streams invite me on

Brian Atlasfor that okay I'll check I've never heard of uh him but I'll check him out thank you man appreciate the recommendation um well I'd also just in response to that comment also like to

Haleysay you know the amount of applicants is proportional to the amount of female Pilots like it's not like that there's a disproportionate amount of female Pilots there's more ma male applicants and that

Haleyshows and I you know it's really fairly unbiased from my perspective and I also think it's important to recognize that there could be male Pilots that are just aren't competent or even the best and

Haleyyou know it's it varies across the board for sure and I think that's where it's important that um good training comes like that's something I really care about obviously is good training and also vetting you know I've had to sit down with people um and say you know I

Haleydon't think you have the right temperament to be a pilot and you should reconsider Flight Training and so awkward it's horrible it's happened twice and they're both man men you know I don't I don't have many female students generally but you know it

Haleyhappens and I think it's important that as a community in aviation we're able to recognize that and and help keep everyone safe by making those calls yeah that well the aviation example that's come up before I don't

Brian Atlasknow exactly where I stand on that but uh I think perhaps a more apt scenario would be would you rather

Haleyhave a male firefighter coming to rescue you or a female firefighter coming to rescue you from a burning building well that's totally different because that has to do with physical size and

Brian Atlasstrength that's not relevant when you're flying an airplane sure and I've I'm moving on from from that I'm not trying to relate it necessarily but I do think that is perhaps a better argument well yeah so brute strength is something men

Jasmine Jafardefinitely have a leg up in but this is one of the things one of my critiques of the Manis spere is jobs that require brute strength manual labor jobs are the ones most at risk risk for automation so again if you're telling men that your value and the thing that makes you important in this world is how

Jasmine Jafarphysically strong you are and your ability to be a bread Winer those are two things where society's moving in a direction that if those are the two things you're basing your your identity on it's a losing it's a losing game yeah but because of like diversity quotas and

Brian Atlasaffirmative action because of Automation and hold on let me finish can you stop interrupting um they have lowered the physical requirements for women to enter some of these uh Fields such as is firefighting

Brian Atlasor the military for example in order for you to pass the uh the physical requirements to join the military to join the army marines Navy whatever it is the requirements are much lower for

Jasmine Jafarwomen I just if that's true then I don't agree with that I don't think firefighting yeah I don't think that should be the case okay but it is yeah but so I agree with you in that regard all right there you go all right so if

Jasmine Jafarthat's happening I disagree with yeah I don't agree I don't think that should I think if there's a standard that should be the stand even if that means that less women than men are firefighters okay well there you have it folks all

Brian Atlasright let me get a couple chats in here and then we'll get into our first topic uh the Logan Paul dilemma uh Jasmine can I have you read this one please your dad is watch you get Raad and probably liked

Jasmine Jafarit this is that's why his tune change weird thing is you know it you do deny that all you do you use insta and ab gear towards teens to advertise your o to teens you do all that too yes I'm

Jasmine Jafaradvertising my o to teens and teens alone I mean feel better that's my good times all right we have KV Moga if you want to read it me yeah sure of girls do you intend to have

Jasmine Jafarchildren do you justify kids having to go through shame trauma and depression because of their mom's greedy ambition you want me to respond to that sure why not so if I do have kids it's going to be like I'm 28 now probably when I'm 34

Jasmine Jafar35 at the earliest by the time they're in school it's like 15 plus years from now I don't I don't think it'll be as much of an issue plus the two biggest contributors to Childhood success are socioeconomic status and maternal

Jasmine Jafareducation and my kid's going to be Balling on both friends so this is the same argument people used to make 10 years ago as to why gay parents shouldn't be able to adopt kids they're like your kids are going to get bullied and now that's not like even a thing

Jasmine Jafarlook how quickly societal attitudes have shifted on on something like that in just such a short period of time I think it's that's a little different though but people wouldn't have said that 10 years ago said what that it oh that's

Jasmine Jafardifferent people hardcore believe that gay yeah but you can't you can't choose to be gay you can choose to do sex 10 years ago a lot of people thought you were choosing that's the thing like you you could choose not to you could choose not to adopt kids if you're gay and that

Jasmine Jafarwas the argument people would make you guys can be gay that's fine but there's no reason to bring a child into this because your child is going to go through all this and Trauma and bullying and now the stats are out that those kids end up doing fine they're not getting bullied in school because they have two dads or two moms yeah but I

Jasmine Jafarthink it's like it's not a fair comparison well I think societ Society shifting one way in general maybe not in spaces like this we are moving towards being more sex positive more um sexually

TTS Readeropen and free I think Martin donated $100 thank you when I'm on invite her back I'll obliterate her she using a

TTS Readermalicious tactic citing studies almost I'll categorically site all my studies device free you and your parents have this in common crme yourself they love me

Emily Raineytonight so everyone supposed to say this do you intend to have children um I will probably have children someday and yeah I think if they're well off

Emily Raineyeconomically I think that's one thing um that would obviously help them in a lot of ways and also there's a lot of ways that you can actually keep your content like off of the internet these days through lawyers and different like

Emily Raineywebsites to help that so like she's saying I do think that Society in general is shifting a lot and I sort of like I mean I know that it will be an issue and I will have to figure out how I'm going to navigate that but I think

Jasmine Jafarit's not as big as an issue as a lot of people 15 years ago we barely had iPhones who knows 15 years from now there could be deep fake porn of all of us like yeah who knows what the world's going to look like 15 years

Lauren Chentechnology-wise if I'm still popping 15 years from now I will take that as a win but I guess so with both of your answers you're kind of acknowledging that this might negatively affect your your child you're you're saying that oh well this

Lauren Chenwill be in the future I can keep it off like offline to the general public you're saying it's 15 years you're saying Society might change their attitudes but you're also saying that'll be in a long time because you know you're only 28 and you don't want to

Jasmine Jafarhave kids just yet so is it fair to say that you are acknowledging that there there is a way that this could of course but I mean like for instance I grew up Persian and a lot of the kids in my school were white and kids used to make fun of me for having Persian food like

Jasmine Jafarwhat were my parents supposed to say like oh okay let's try to have you not be bullied I don't plan on raising my kids to appease the whims of like the most immature population which is like school school kids so yes they could get bullied over this and yes that is I'm

Jasmine Jafarnot saying this isn't a possibility it can't happen but I think kids can get bullied almost over everything I mean you're a conservative political pundit if you go to if your kids go to school and there's some really liberal parents there that or something your kids are

Jasmine Jafargoing to get bullied because of what you do because half of the country at least disagrees with you so there's a big portion of the country that also finds what I do controversial so again I think it's something that is is a possibility but I think there's so many mitigating factors and I also think a lot of the

Jasmine Jafarpeople that asked that maybe not this part particular commenter are just they don't actually care about kids if you cared about kids you would go volunteer at a children's hospital you could do things with kids that actually exist now instead of my hypothetical future potential children so that's that's I

Lauren Chenalso don't think it's a question generally asked in good faith not with you or maybe this commentary but in general right and I guess the reason why I asked this is because I I I'm a mom I have a kid and obviously like you said kids are going to be bullied I plan on

Lauren Chenhomeschooling so hopefully that mitigate some things but do you think that as mothers or potential mothers that you have a responsibility to I guess behave in such a way where your child would be proud of you and I'm not saying that you

Lauren Chenknow maybe you're you're going to raise your kid in a way that having an only fans mom is something that they're proud of but how do you how do you plan on navigating that like do you do you want your kid to be aware from a young age

Lauren Chenthat you did only fans are would you be upset if you have a daughter and she does only fans like how how are your feelings with only fans kind of related to your so those are two questions I think just like there's a sex appro an appropriate way to talk to Children about sex education I think there's also

Jasmine Jafaran age appropriate way to talk to Children about sex work depending on the age and all that now would I care if my daughter did this um my only goal for my children is to be happy and healthy and kind people so I have no intention of bringing children to the world so I can

Jasmine Jafarbe proud of them or that they can align with me and do everything I want people who have children to make them an extension of themselves shouldn't have children so again if this is what my daughter does and she's happy and she's healthy and she's safe go for it if she wants to be a waitress go for it if she

Lauren Chenwants to be a neurosurgeon go for it so yeah that's my answer so do you not see any and it's like with your with your parents I'm so glad that you you say that you're you have a good relationship because I think if if any displeasure they voice with you it's because they love you I mean I don't it sounds like

Lauren Chenyou guys have a great relationship but I'm happy about that do you can you understand why a parent could love their child and not want them to just be an extension of themselves but still not want them to do only fans I can totally

Jasmine Jafarsee it because they see it like my mom also thought tampons are only for virgins like she grew up she was married a virgin she's only ever been with my dad so it's really hard for them to break away from these values so they think that what I'm doing is unhealthy

Jasmine Jafarbut that may not necessarily be true so again my goal for my child is not them doing what I think is healthy or what I think is great or what aligns with my values it's just that they're overall happy healthy kids I can tell you in the Persian Community it's such a thing that

Jasmine Jafarparents just go to like like these parties and they're like my son has PhD my son like is at Stanford and like it's like are your kids happy though because a lot of times they're not you have no idea how many messages I get from Children of immigrant families who are like I don't want to be a doctor I don't

Jasmine Jafarwant to do this but your story inspired me to be honest with my parents about that it doesn't mean they have to go into sex work it just means to live a life conducive to their own happiness and that's all I would want for my kids but and obviously I'm not advocating I'm

Lauren Chenhalf Chinese but I I think you can totally not be a doctor or a lawyer and still do all right in life but um can you understand why that even if you want the the child to be happy and healthy that may not as a parent mean condoning

Jasmine Jafarwhatever they want to do at the time yeah under age like I I was 26 when I started my only fans if my daughter's 16 and she's like I want to start an only fans yeah we're going to have a discussion about that because I don't think your your prefrontal cortex isn't

Jasmine Jafareven developed yet and this has lifelong consequences which I agreed with you with but if she's 25 26 and she's like Mom I want to do this blah blah blah this is what I think is going to make me happy here's how I plan to use a yeah so but I mean I guess looking at the rates

Lauren Chenof women who are only in the sex industry for a short amount of time and then they end up leaving it which I'm guessing means they weren't really satisfied in it otherwise they would have stayed in for longer the women who you know talk about things like how it's damaged their potential for long-term

Lauren Chenrelationships in the future there was a study I think it's something like 75% of only fans creators do report that it has negatively impacted their relationships in in one way or another again 100 is is not the same as 75 so you can make an

Lauren Chenargument it's not everybody but can you see that there are like this isn't just another job right this isn't just like becoming a teacher or a politician there are a lot of consequences we're not even talking about religion here just to

Jasmine Jafartheir ability to work other jobs in the future have other relationships whatever that this makes it a very big difference a different decision than wanting to go into engineering or something which is exactly why I would want like I said informed consent from the person which

Jasmine Jafaris why I agree that really young girls that may not know about these consequences shouldn't do I think also a lot of people are in the industry and they leave because as you get older you can't it's like it's like being a professional athlete like you only have a short amount of time but nobody tells professional athletes oh why would you

Jasmine Jafarwant to do that like you can only do it for a short amount of time they say oh that's people do people do tell athletes that generally especially like if maybe they do I don't know I've never heard anyone like be like oh my god you're an athlete like what a terrible profession you're only

Jasmine Jafarin it for a short amount of time whatever so I don't necessarily think that's the problem but I agree with you that I would want any any woman or any man anyone to do that's doing this work to be aware of those consequences but

Jasmine JafarI'm thinking in the in the position with my child yes if they do anything reck recklessly that could affect them for the rest of their lives if my daughter got married at 18 I would lose my mind CU that you're so young so it doesn't matter any lifelong decision that they

Jasmine Jafarmake from a young age without full informed consent I wouldn't be happy about but it's not the profession of only fans in particular that I have an issue with if they have informed consent about about it just like you can't have

Jasmine Jafarfull informed consent at 18 you can but I think it's it's you may not your your brain isn't fully developed so I'm not saying that 18-year-olds can't do only fans what I'm saying is I've had a lot of younger

Jasmine Jafargirls that come to me I want to be like you you're making all this money blah blah blah blah blah and I'm like I don't think you can fully grasp like I will talk to them and I'll let them know that this has consequences you may not fully

Jasmine Jafarbe able to grasp because your prefrontal cortex still is like 6 seven years from developing so that's kind of my argument there doesn't mean I think they can't or they shouldn't be able to do it I just don't think that their their brain is

Jasmine Jafarfully developed enough scientifically even to be able to fully grasp the consequences the way they would if they were my age that's what I'm saying all right let me get some chats out of the

Brian Atlasway shut her mic off purple shirt berbert has no clue she's talking about in regards to how kids fair with LGBT parents the study that said they were just as well off as kids was straight

Jasmine Jafarwith straight parents was funded by the CCP uh and that's a link I guess to there's been multiple studies that show that as long as you measure for socioeconomic status and all that they do tend to do as well and there's

Jasmine Jafardefinitely not a huge bullying problem with them at least in 2023 maybe if they're like the middle of Arkansas but like in California no Masson can you read this one to respond to the of diversity hire

Madisonabout women women evolving from their grandmothers women becoming mattress actresses on the internet shows that women are devolving and not evolving I don't think men would be having this issue with struggling we wouldn't be

Jasmine Jafaroutpacing them and kicking their ass in education even in the labor market like men's wages have been stagnant which I don't think is a good thing while ours have been rising like we are women are doing better in this Society than in previous Society so while it's your

Jasmine Jafaropinion that this is an example of devolving for instance I'm really happy I had this option and now I'm I've make seven figures and I'm able to have all the time money and freedom that I enjoy so for me it was a good thing but I mean

Lauren Chenit's also true that women and not speaking of your own situation but women in average like especially for white women the rates of depression are they're really skyrocketing right more women than ever have clinical diagnoses

Lauren Chenwhether that's depression anxiety and they're medicated so I think it we can say that yeah obviously women have made a lot of grounds in terms of economics and finances but I feel like it has come

Lauren Chenat a cost to for for a lot of women our mental health and our overall work life balance which women purport to be way less happy about than men on average so I think that like for instance the medication thing I think a lot of people

Jasmine Jafarare overmedicated these days and men are men are are more on that stuff too so there's a correlation versus causation things so while it's true and I think there are great I've read a lot of books on this uh lost connections Johan har is a great book on this I think social media can have an impact but to say it's

Jasmine Jafarbecause they're less involved in their roles as mothers and especially mothers because while studies do show marriage tend to make people happier kids don't and the happiness Gap is the largest in the United States actually so I don't

Jasmine Jafarthink that to jump to oh women are unhappier so the reason must be especially when there's no evidence to bear that out is because they're not wives and and mothers is erroneous well I mean they have done studies that show that I mean married

Jasmine Jafarpeople tend to be happier than not non people kid have the opposite so it's like okay do you think that they should just should we just be supporting dink Lifestyles to dual income no kids because that seems to be what shows to be the happiest now that's for everybody right there's also study out of

Lauren ChenUniversity of Michigan that came out recently showing that people who chose not to have kids don't end up regretting it later so it's not for everybody right but there are also studies that like we obviously it's important to talk about happiness because we don't want to be unhappy but they've also measured things

Lauren Chenlike loneliness and people who aren't married who don't have kids they are more likely to be something like yeah so I think having meaningful connections is one of the biggest contributors to happiness get out we are I guess like

Jasmine Jafarnot just women not just men in general as we have progressed we are falling short in those areas in those areas so that's a big thing I just talked about lost connections Johan har he talks about this that social media people aren't getting outside more people don't

Jasmine Jafarhave um communities anymore I mean there was like back in the day if you ask how many close friends do you have people had like oh I have three out of five now the average is zero especially for men men seem to be really struggling finding friendships or having those good

Jasmine Jafarfriendships so I agree with you there but I don't think the the answer is okay we go back we I don't even think that's practical and I don't think that that is the reason oh women are now in the workforce that's why we're loner we've had social media which has deeply

Jasmine Jafarcontributed to it there are other factors that could be causing it and so it's a correlation causation problem all right let's get these chats in wouldn't you like to

Madisonknow uh MADD can you read it huge fan of the Pod been listening to every pod on Spotify while I'm trekking across the country glad to see you're doing better what happened to the 5 to six hour pods

Madisonenjoy listening regardless send the 304 to the streets bring Shapiro on to red fill these ladies uh wouldn't you like to know thank you for the Super Chat man appreciate it

Brian Atlasuh I'm not going to reveal who but very soon we are going to have someone from the daily wire uh on the show not not Shapiro but somebody else so uh that

Brian Atlasshould be fun um we've been making the pods shorter I don't really want to I'm not going to go into it but

Brian Atlasuh we've had had some noise complaints even though this is like basically a tame dinner party type

Brian Atlasconversation like uh so we've been trying to end the shows earlier so we might start having

Brian Atlasthe shows uh start sooner here maybe I don't know soon actually I think our Tuesday show we're going to start 1 hour early so we might

Madisonwe're uh potentially in the works of uh starting earlier David mccoin thank you go ahead Madison if women want equality why don't women fight to be included in the draft seems like they want rights

Jasmine Jafarwithout responsibility oh my God the way responsibility is spelled sorry I don't want to be also I'm I think a lot of people are just against it the draft hasn't been triggered in over 50 years and I think

Lauren Chenif it was people would have an issue with it including a lot of feminists yeah well feminists they're official position if you have one official position as a feminist group is to abolish the draft

Brian Atlasentirely so for men I agree with that yeah but is that that's kind of wishful thinking it it occurs to me that a country needs to have a draft in the event of some sort

Brian Atlasof catastrophic War I don't think a draft is good but it's plausible that a country would need to call upon its citizens to defend said country I don't think anyone should be forced by their

Jasmine Jafargovernment to go die for the country then who would be I mean if we don't have enough people that volunteer to do it then that's but I don't believe the answer is forcing people that's me though so okay so then you've I mean

TTS Readeryou've basically surrendered your country to I think I rather surrender my country than force people donated

TTS Reader$99 Brian sha named me Giga simp simpo and requested me on next with my boala haa let's make it happen I promise you'll break your donation record do my

Brian Atlasresearch for both sides and when I'm wrong I take accountability to everyone does body count matter well we'll touch on body count in in just a bit uh thank

Brian Atlasyou man appreciate it Matt um okay so we were talking about the dra the draft the draft well I actually

Brian Atlasthink that's a really solid argument for why feminism is not actually about true equality why she just said the feminist POS position is to abolish the draft for

Jasmine Jafarboth genders well I mean and it hasn't been triggered in 50 years anyone who's like talking about the draft is like they're like that's the topic that they're focused on is focused on something bizarre it hasn't been

Brian Atlastriggered in 50 years but all men over the age of 18 upon turning 18 have to register for the draft yeah and I'm against that but it hasn't been no you like nobody in our generation no but you're not going to you're not going to

Jasmine Jafarget rid of the draft therefore we ought to equalize it I think that if it was to get triggered I would be on the front line of saying that nobody should be allowed on it nobody should be allowed in it okay that's great war is terrible

Jasmine Jafarwell aren't you the one that said happens okay so aren't you the one that just said that if there's like physical standards for getting in to do firefighting if there are physical standards to get into the war a lot of women wouldn't meet those requirements but you could be drafted into the war

Brian Atlaseffort and have a supportive role you don't but but women are entir hold on but women are entirely exempt from even being drafted into a support role that doesn't even face the risk of seeing combat okay so in that sense if we're

Jasmine Jafargoing to have a draft sure we can both be in it but I'm saying neither of us should be in it so well that okay but there shouldn't be War like it's just such it's even if there is War I don't believe in a draft that's what I'm saying now if we're going to have one

Brian Atlasanyway I don't think it's fair that just men are drafted I'll give you that right but women aren't in the streets like demanding that they be because this is a non-issue right now it's not it's not a non-issue yes none of our lives right

Brian Atlasnow are impacted by the draft not a single person no that's that's wrong because men are required to register upon 2018 there's certain hold on there's certain uh you it's harder to

Brian Atlaspotentially qualify for certain uh I believe student loans you're barred from certain federal jobs if you aren't registered technically on the books it's

Jasmine Jafara felony there's a $500,000 fine now whether a prosecutor would actually prosecute it no but perhaps in Wartime they might prosecute it in war time so when this is the reason the reason people aren't on the street is because

Jasmine Jafarthere's no it's not wartime and so most men that are registering for the draft that's the end of of what they were arguably in the least stable place in the past 40 years and there isn't any

Brian Atlaslike talk of the draft being triggered by anyone other than the mosphere no but it's it's a totally valid thing for example like you're a woman here in California you I I'm assuming well I

Brian Atlasshouldn't assume but here in California you can secure an abort abortion yeah did you take quarrel with ro ro v Wade being overturned even though your right to an abortion in

Jasmine JafarCalifornia is secure yes because I believe in sub it doesn't affect you but Des it's a constitutional right that I think was taken away I and it didn't just take away that if we want to get into the law on substantive due process

Jasmine JafarI'm obviously very familiar with it we can get into that but it completely took out substantive due process out of the Constitution which does also like people have made the argument um affect decisions Like Loving V Virginia

Brian Atlasthose the right of your children to go to certain the school you want that well I'm not I'm not interested at least right so the reason that I have an issue with let me finish I'm not interested right now in in having an abortion

Brian Atlasdiscussion but this idea that well oh it doesn't really impact anybody that there's the draft well that's it's just not true it does impact people there there's men who because they failed to

Brian Atlasregister are barred from getting certain loans they're barred from uh getting uh entry in certain Government Federal you're every male's life in the United States today is their only thing is

Jasmine Jafarregistering for the draft and then going on and living their normal life so it'd be weird if people were just on the streets AB if if people were on the streets protesting to abolish the draft and I saw that i' be like oh what's going on like is there a war happening because in general people don't go on

Brian Atlasthe streets and start picketing for something that isn't happening it's just not happening all that's happening is they have to register so should women in California not fight for even though there's pretty much zero chance constitutional right and I care about

Jasmine Jafarother women consti right I think it's a constitutional right so if we want to get into that we can but it's also other women are impacted it's not like no men in the United States right now other than being impacted by having to register for something well that's

Jasmine Jafaractually not true there are men alive today who were drafted yeah but in the Vietnam War yes but there hasn't been for men that now turn 18 and have to register it's not going to be a significant part of their lives if there becomes a time where it is a part of

Brian Atlastheir lives and they are being drafted I think we would see people out on the street I'm almost certain we'd see people out probably not think very unlikely well here's a bigger one there are men who would be alive today had there not been the draft and I just said

Jasmine JafarI don't like drafts like that's great that's great but this is a specifically male focused yeah so if we want to go back if we want to do tip Fort back in history we can go at it Brian but yeah here's an example I don't think those men should have been drafted I'm very

Lauren Chensorry that they lost their lives fighting for our country but yeah if we want to go back in time and talk about when women were oppressed or men were oppressed we could do that go ahead well this is kind of I mean the reason why this was mentioned is because of women not wanting responsibility like draft

Lauren Chenfor voting how do you guys feel about service guaranteeing citizenship we get rid of the draft but hey if you want to be able to vote you have to do some sort of service including

Jasmine Jafarmilitary my thoughts everybody's thoughts every so in order to vote you have to you have to join you have to be you have to just sign up for the military or or some other form of

Lauren Chenservice but the idea that a vote is not uh I mean in Korea I think there's not just military service they also have uh different types of service I I think some people might have like religious qualifications but the idea that it's

Lauren Chenoften talked about in the manosphere women want white rights without the responsibility and that's an issue that I I have with feminist movement as well and it's an issue I have with universal suffrage so what about the idea that if you actually want this right you also

Jasmine Jafarhave to take on responsibility so that's not gender specific um so that's just I the only thing I mean I think it depends on what would qualify if it's accessible to everybody like paying tax not no but

Jasmine Jafarlike if it's accessible to everybody then sure but I think it would just create barriers where certain people who had the privilege to sign up for this stuff or had the privilege like versus someone who's just struggling to get by is working a bunch of hours can't also have time to serve their community that

Jasmine Jafarthey don't get a vote that would be my worry there but I don't it's not gendered so like service Civil Service type stuff like they have to do community

Lauren Chenlike pick up trash like what exactly is your I mean I I I think that would that should qualify I just I don't like the idea that and this is often why the draft is brought up because it's in relation to the 19th Amendment women were given the right to vote but unlike

Lauren Chenmen we never had to register for the right to draft and I think that's a legitimate grievance that a lot of men have and I'm just thinking of ways that we could seek to remedy that but also not have zero military so my remedy is

Jasmine Jafarjust different than yours I would abolish the draft that's just never going to happen though you can't abolish the draft I think that there would definitely be a conversation about it we're talking

Jasmine Jafarabout again some crazy like we're going to go to war and now the draft I think clearly we haven't used the draft even though we've had wars in the last 50 years because there have been people that have volunteered to go we didn't use it for the Iraq War we haven't used it in Afghanistan we haven't used it and

Jasmine JafarI think if there was another War I don't think we would use it because I think people know there'd be an uproar about it in 2023 um and I would be on the front line saying we should abolish it not saying men should be the only ones

Brian Atlaswho have to go right there it hasn't been used in a long time but that still doesn't nothing to diminish the fact that men are still subject to military conscription I

Jasmine Jafarthat's what I'm saying it shouldn't be the case but I'm also saying the reason it's not a main issue is because any man who's going to bed or waking up like oh my God I'm so like I'm in the draft I'm in the draft you're you should get a job and work like focus on things that are

Brian Atlasactually happening to you that's rather that's rather let me let me just say one thing that's rather dismiss of men's concerns when it comes to their uh their basically being forced

Brian Atlasto die in the military conflict you might think that that's fanciful that you might think there's not a strong likelihood that well certainly in the US

Brian Atlasperhaps not but take for example Ukraine which is a starting to become a fairly westernized country mhm uh still to this day men between the ages of of I believe

Jasmine Jafar18 to 60 maybe even 65 they're unable to leave the country yeah okay and if no limit there's no such limit on women okay but if we want to go globally on tip for tap for women a lot of places

Jasmine Jafarwomen still can't go to schools women still can't even drive in some places so if we're going to go globally we can go globally yeah so there's M if we're going to go globally I think there are far more examples of women still being oppressed especially I mean like I told you my parents are from Iran you see

Jasmine Jafarwhat's going on there women are getting killed for not covering their hair that's not happening anywhere in the in the world for men and so if we're I think Western Society is one where it's more fair but if we're going to go globally then I think globally women

Jasmine Jafarthat's one example where men may be disadvantaged but we can find far more with women have less access to education women are still getting killed for having sex outside of marriage in some places like honor killings disproportionately affect women child

Brian Atlasmarriages affect wom I mean we can go back and forth exactly that's why I didn't want to use the Ukraine argument pril or victim Olympics we we can go back and forth I mean but I'm i' I'd actually be prepared to make the

Brian Atlasargument that globally speaking men are oh God okay that that uh I mean the sole male grievance of forced military

Brian Atlasconscription in my estimation dwarfs all of women's Collective grievances combined something $100 abolish the draft make military

TTS Readerservice compulsory for both men and women with civil service as an alternative for those who are not physically qualified voting rights tied to service service guarantees

Lauren Chencitizenship would you like to know more uh thank you Raven you wanted to come in on something Lauren um well I guess to better understand why someone like Brian might be upset about it you

Lauren Chenwere clearly upset about the idea of Ro Row versus Wade being taken from you but think about it a man can do a lot less to ensure he's not drafted than a woman can do to ensure she doesn't need an abortion so I would say the difference

Jasmine Jafaris RO V weight does affect there have been women since roie Wade has been overturned that weren't able to have access to an abortion there haven't been men in the last 50 years that have been drafted so and and it's not something

Jasmine Jafarwell men don't have any Reproductive Rights to begin with that's because the baby isn't in your body so once the baby's born there's no the laws are gender neutral there's no so it once the

Jasmine Jafarbaby's born if what happens is whichever parent if there's one primary um U one primary caregiver then they're entitled to child support from the other so child support is actually going up up from um women to men now because there are more

Jasmine Jafarmen that are in the primary caretaker role or neither of you can be the parent and you guys can give it up for adoption now neither of you but once it's it's so fair because it's literally once the baby's in the stomach of the woman then she has rights that the male doesn't

Jasmine Jafarhave but as soon as the child is born it's it's equal so you have a problem with Biology honestly no I don't have a problem with Biology okay so what's your problem what do you mean that you're mad that men don't have Reproductive Rights

Brian Atlasbut men don't carry children well there there's what whatever the choice may be let's say the woman wants to get rid of the child the man has no say there if she wants to keep the child the man has

Brian Atlasno say there uh and then also there's a term called uh I'm trying to recall what it is uh force or no it's uh legal

Brian Atlaspaternal surrender so let's say the woman wants to have the kid the guy doesn't they're in a legal paternal surrender scenario

Brian Atlasthe guy could say well I don't want to have any legal obligation to the child mhm so not being subject to having to pay for child support for example okay so there's is that so there's a reproductive right I guess I didn't even

Jasmine Jafarknow about that no it's well it's not no that's not something that is the case oh well that's not so once the child is born for instance if the woman said I don't actually want it after it's born but the father wants it even if she wants to give it away for adoption she

Jasmine Jafarcan't now he as long as he's fit to be a parent he can have he's now the primary custody he is now the primary custodian and has to P him child support So once the child is born tell me where it's not fair it's only when the child is yes

Jasmine Jafarthat's but I'm not I'm saying before the child is born yeah so do you think if men carried the child do you think it would be like well that's a biological impossibility exctly so because it's a biological impossibility I'm sorry that

Jasmine Jafarthe world made it so that the child isn't our bodies and that's just the reality of biology it's not cuz we set out to have it that way I think a lot of women would love if their husbands could carry the child instead or the men men could car that's not the argument I'm

Brian Atlasmaking so what is the argument you're making that while the child saying that that this idea that abortion is necessarily a gendered issue men just have no Reproductive Rights to begin

Jasmine Jafarwith they don't have Reproductive Rights when the child is not using their body as a host that's the only time they don't have Reproductive Rights that are equal to women sure okay so that's an issue with

Jasmine JafarBiology I don't know what to tell you there it's not we didn't decide to be the ones that carry children but we are the ones that carry children which means that that is the case now if men could carry children too I'd be all in favor of them being able to make the same decisions with their body that women

Brian Atlasshould be able to make right there's obviously biological differences but again the point I'm trying to make is is that men don't have any Reproductive Rights now there can be we can have a debate over what that would potentially

Jasmine Jafarlook like but what I'm trying to say is men don't have any Reproductive Rights but men aren't caring children and that's why which is a yeah so so it's a bi biological inequality that I guess

Brian Atlasfor men it sucks in this instance we got to that I don't either was that but did you have something more Lauren or um not that I

Brian Atlasremember I would just point out that this is a draft registration card here and note it says men 18 to 25 you can

Brian Atlashandle this you can handle this and uh there's you know don't let the colors fool you that's that's the registration

Lauren Chenportion uh all men have to do this when when they turn 18 uh do most men do it what are the I'm just curious what are the like well I mean I have um so I'm I'm not like from America so I I know a

Lauren Chenlot of other people who have kind of immigrated later and I have had some of my like college friends who've gotten green cards later on in life kind of joke about hey if if it takes just a few more years I don't have to register for the draft so it is something that they

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