Men Make NO EFFORT?! What Do They Bring To The Table? HEATED DEBATE w/ Feminists! | Dating Talk #131
Date: 2024-01-31
Duration: 6h 12m
Guests
Brian AtlasIdentified Speakers
SPEAKER_00TTS Reader(audience)
SPEAKER_01Jake(guest)
SPEAKER_03Ariana(guest)
SPEAKER_04Kayla(guest)
SPEAKER_06Brian Atlas(host)
SPEAKER_07TTS Reader(audience)
SPEAKER_08Lily(guest)
SPEAKER_09Toia(guest)
SPEAKER_10Vanika(guest)
SPEAKER_11Shay(guest)
SPEAKER_12Katie(guest)
Key Moments
00:02:54
IntroGuest introductions begin. Kayla opens as first guest: tooth technician, 24, Joshua Tree CA.
“my name is Kayla I'm 24 years old I'm from Joshua Tree California and I am a tooth technician”
00:03:15
IntroToia introduces herself: 20yo UCSB economics student, Bay Area. Says she is "so single and so happy about it."
“hi I'm toia I'm a 20-year-old from the Bay Area I go to school here at UCSB and I'm a student”
00:03:16
IntroKatie introduces herself as non-monogamous/polyamorous with an overseas lover.
“my name is Katie I'm 29 I'm originally from Vermont and I work in child care”
01:34:24
Key MomentBrian states his personal rule: if he goes on a first date and is interested, all other men must be out of the picture before a second date.
“my personal standard on this is if I go on the first date with a girl and I'm interested in pursuing her all the other guys have to be a rap”
02:34:42
QuoteJake discloses that his own promiscuous past has "come back to bite" him with principled women.
“if I could take back time I'd probably be a little bit more frugal with it if I was your age”
03:09:06
OtherNaraj mock proposal moment: Brian puts a ring on Vanika's finger on-air. Vanika says she would consider marrying Naraj if he is willing to wait while she builds herself.
“he drove you here yes because my car broke... will you marry Naraj”
03:48:06
OtherToia reads her lengthy written list of partner requirements live on air, covering ~20+ detailed criteria.
“emotional and not afraid to admit their feelings existential and or philosophical interested in the world driven and ambitious...”
04:04:12
QuoteJake states his ideal woman must 'fear God', preferably be a virgin or very low body count, feminine, submissive, and want to have a big family.
“she has to fear God she has to be a Godly woman she has to not has to but preferably a virgin if not a very low body count with only Partners feminine submissive loyal and just wants to have a family and multiply”
04:07:24
OtherBrian reads out his detailed partner preference list on air — including preference for natural bodies, no plastic surgery, no big labia plasty, moderate looks, introversion, low body count.
“any race is fine but I do have a slight preference for white women... strong preference for no plastic surgery no fake tits no fake lips no BBL”
04:38:00
ControversyJake claims feminism is "the worship of the devil" and cites book Occult Feminism by Rachel Wilson.
“feminism is the worship of the devil... you can read a book called occult feminism by Rachel Wilson”
04:45:12
Key MomentKayla reads out Mallerie Millett quote on destroying the American family through promiscuity and homosexuality.
“why are we here today she asked to make a revolution... how do we destroy the American patriarchy by destroying monogamy... by promoting promiscuity eroticism prostitution and homosexuality”
05:31:48
ControversyBrian's warfare argument: male suffering in WWI/WWII and forced conscription outweighs all women's collective grievances historically and in modern day.
“that sole grievance that men have nearly exclusively experienced outweighs in orders of magnitude more than all of women's Collective Grievances and that is Warfare”
06:08:00
QuoteBrian closes show noting circumcision as modern-day male bodily autonomy argument.
“most men in this country are circumcised upon birth... they have their genitals mutilated I know you're laughing I'm sure it's funny to you”
Topics Discussed
00:02:54
Introductions & relationship statuses
Guests introduce themselves with name, age, location, occupation. Panel discusses current relationship statuses including long-distance, polyamory, situationships, and singlehood.
00:26:49
American men vs international men
Discussion on whether American men lack effort compared to international men. Toia and Shay argue international men (European, Israeli, Australian) put in more effort and are more mature. Jake and Brian push back.
00:35:00
Do men make enough effort in dating
Main debate: whether men make adequate effort in modern dating. Panel discusses LA dating culture, hookup culture at UCSB, and what constitutes effort (flowers, dates, communication).
01:34:24
How long to wait before sex / the waiting standard
Extended debate on whether women should wait to have sex vs sleeping with someone immediately. Discussion of double standards when women sleep with some men immediately but make others wait. Reddit post about woman sleeping with FWB while making boyfriend wait.
02:27:00
Ho phases & past promiscuity
Panel discusses personal "ho phases." Kayla describes overlapping dating at ages 17-19. Katie discusses polyamory. Jake reflects on his own promiscuous past and regrets.
03:00:00
Do men need to pay on first dates
Brian argues men should only pay for traditionally-minded women. If a woman is non-traditional, she should expect non-traditional treatment (50/50).
03:06:00
Penis size discussion
Tangential discussion after TTS donation. Guests estimate ideal penis size via hand gestures on camera.
03:09:06
Vanika / Naraj proposal moment
Brian stages a mock marriage proposal between Vanika and her admirer Naraj (who drove her to the show after her car broke down). Vanika tries on a ring but declines immediate marriage.
03:13:00
Polyamory / open relationships
Katie discusses non-monogamy and having a primary overseas lover. Brian and Jake argue polyamory is bad for society and family formation. Destiny divorce cited as example.
03:36:00
What guests are looking for in a partner
Guests share their dream partner lists. Toia reads her lengthy written list. Brian shares his detailed preferences including dislike of plastic surgery, preference for natural women, introverts, low body count.
04:00:00
Feminism: history, the patriarchy, wage gap
Jake quotes feminist Mallerie Millett on destroying the American family. Discussion on whether women are oppressed, the wage gap, STEM participation, and the definition of patriarchy.
04:53:00
Are women better looking now or in 10/20 years
Light topic: guests say whether they think they will be better looking in 10 or 20 years. Most say yes; Brian says he peaked at 19 and won't be better looking.
05:30:00
Men vs women oppression: warfare & conscription
Brian argues male-specific suffering from warfare and forced military conscription outweighs all women's collective grievances. Guests debate selective service, bodily autonomy, circumcision, and historical context.
Transcript
Page 2 of 7
00:56:22
Jakefeelings and and I know you're not busy as well so I'm actually busy you're not busy so yeah that's one thing that I'd appreciate thank you for sharing my
00:56:34
Brian Atlaspleasure okay I want to go back really quick to uh some of the people's relationship statuses so we have so single and then uh never been in a
00:56:43
Brian Atlasrelationship um I'm curious uh are there any you said you're so single there's nobody in the picture right now it's amazing nobody in the
00:56:55
Jakepicture nope are you I was I was going to say because you you dat you're dating at college or like you're you're so single but like you previously dating at at College yeah college or traveling have you considered dating older guys
00:57:08
Toiayeah if you're looking for someone who's a little bit more sort of 100% yeah yes but you're not doing that at the moment being so single nope I just got back from being on the other side of the world I have a lot of like passions and
00:57:19
Toialike career things that I'm doing I have classes I'm also really busy I don't have the time or effort to invest in a relationship and I don't want to hook up really right now so yeah oh so you're
00:57:29
Brian Atlascibit I mean right now yeah sure well hold on uh sure I mean is there there's there's a little sneaky Link in the picture or no no no sneaky linkink zero
00:57:42
Brian Atlassneaky links zero sneaky links an occasional sneaky link nope okay all right nope what about you sneaky link couple sneaky links maybe maybe okay what what you working with I I mean I
00:57:55
Lilyjust don't want to be committed to anyone right now so totally F I'm here for experience I really really like having experiences with people and you know if that leads to sex and that leads to sex but if it doesn't that doesn't I just like it's whatever it's in the
00:58:07
Lilymoment I think is what I feel like is what I do people well so currently um you know are there there people you're like sneaky links you got any sneaky
00:58:18
Vanikalinks yes any 11:00 p.m. WDS can I ask the sneaking in means like what you trying to say uh sneaky link it's kind of like someone
00:58:29
Brian Atlasyou're very casually hooking up with and okay I got it your people might I mean the sneaky part is like nobody else might know about it
00:58:39
Brian Atlaslike your friends might not know about so it's very on the on the down low um yeah you got what are we talking here
00:58:49
Brian Atlasyou got like cuz I I detect like I feel like you got Riz me I think you got game yeah I think you lay it down like who like I think you got game with both men
00:59:00
Brian Atlasand women though like insane RZ I do like like legendary status RZ what made you think this I it's just like a Vibe I just the best I think that's the best compliment I've ever
00:59:13
Brian Atlasreceived in my whole life thank you you're welcome God you're welcome but I think like you know you step to a girl and the girl's like oh what's up so anyways um I'm curious though cuz cuz of
00:59:23
Lilyyour like insane levels of Riz yes you got some you got a couple you got a roster is what I'm getting at do you have a roster no personally I only
00:59:34
Lilylike to like be not even talking to but just like one person at a time at time yeah I can't do multiple people I fully salute if you can it's just not me I see I can't do that but I do have insane Riz
00:59:45
Brian Atlaswith one person you you have insane RZ with one one specific person one specific person and is that your current situation yes I see okay male female male male actually I just went on the
00:59:57
Brian Atlaswell I just went on the first date last week and you know we're talking so it's going good it's going good would you describe yourself as a well I was going to say serial monogamist but it sounds like you haven't really had a
01:00:10
Lilyrelationship really so like I said you're like a Serial situation no not even I don't know what the term would be for that like I go on dates with people and you know if we don't Vibe I'll be very straight up and I'll be like yo like I'm not really
01:00:22
Lilyfeeling this I'm very honest so I'm like I'm not really extremely honest to a fault cuz I feel like that's I don't want to waste your time and I don't want
01:00:30
Brian Atlasyou to waste mine personally like wait so let's reenact yes a date do I have my do I have a hat I can wear a hat here we go let's just say you're with like a
01:00:42
Lilyfrat boy American I would not be with a frat boy we're already wrong is this is this the type of guy absolutely not you look like I'll take absolutely not uh so
01:00:54
Brian Atlasokay okay we're on a date um where where where's like a date You' like did you go get food or what well typically I'll either go like uh to restaurants or go to the gym with a guy that's like the CH on the first date you'll go to the gym yes okay what do you want to hit some
01:01:06
Lilysquats or well I'm a powerlifter so I feel like I go for guys who go to the gym and so we kind of that's do you think you could bench Jake well how much do you weigh about 87 kilos I know kilos
01:01:17
Brian Atlasthey're americ I don't know what is that in pounds I think it's like 180 lb no definitely not definitely not but like I'll go on I think Spencer was like let me do the Jiu-Jitsu conversion right
01:01:29
JakeSpencer like he's got it down um it's 180 I cannot do oh my God no I cannot bench 180 do you think if I laid there like like like a prawn you could lift me you could deadlift me oh yeah I could
01:01:40
Lilydeadlift you for sure could you jerk and clean oh my God I need to learn how to do that I I want to learn how to do that take you out to the chair oh please we'll use one of the smaller members of
01:01:50
Brian Atlasthe it's a date and we'll do it okay okay okay see I got that wait it's okay uh let's let's role play this yeah well do you want me okay I can what are we we role playing we're on the date well you said you're super like if
01:02:04
Lilyyou're on the date and you're not really feeling it like will you up front just be like you suck oh no no no no I'm very respectful I'll go on the date for example the last I not the last date I went on it was really good but the
01:02:15
Lilydate before that I was just not feeling it the guy showed up 2 hours late and he brought a friend okay oh was it he's a young young guy wasn't he no he was old which was very surprising wait hold on
01:02:27
Lilyhe he set up the date yes so we had arranged to go on this date food food date we were going to go bowling bowling oh yeah so we were going to go bowling and then he texts me and he's like by the way I brought my friend do you have
01:02:38
Lilya friend for mine like so I'm like trying to get my roommate in on this but then it turns out he's 2 hours late so my roommate doesn't want to go so it's me him and then his friend trying to go bowling yeah and so I was very
01:02:51
Brian Atlasrespectful throughout the whole date but then after the fact I was just like hey I just don't think this is going to work out it's personally not I'm actually I got to give you flowers on that because two hours late he's asking to bring a friend when it sounds to me I mean I we
01:03:03
Brian Atlasdon't see that we don't know what the texts were but I'm going to take your word for it it was very clear that it was like you were going to meet up with him for absolutely uh I mean I give you
01:03:13
Brian Atlasprops for actually I mean I would have if I think more than 20 minutes you I leave I'm not Ein stain but um but uh the guy's in the wrong in that situation
01:03:26
Lily100% being two hours late that's and then asking to bring do you know why he wanted to BR was he like just a coward like scared I don't know I I never really asked why he was with his friend I mean I did ask him to take me home though like halfway through the day I
01:03:39
Brian Atlaswas just like Jake do you do any coaching this guy needs your help dude I don't he needs somebody's help what's he doing this guy I think the friend needs help why would you want to go H I was talking to the friend more than the date
01:03:51
Katiehimself so weird prob why I that's so weird the friend was weird too that he agreed to go with him yeah I know interesting was his friend hotter no rip I know or else I would
01:04:04
Katiehave gone for the friends say maybe that's why he brought the friend was like okay this is my hot friend and all my girlfriends always leave me for my hotter friend so if I bring him and she doesn't flirt with him then it's okay
01:04:14
Jakethat's terrible logic it's man logic I mean you want you know you want to bring the ugly gregarious friend not the better looking friend friend in General on a date just
01:04:26
Brian Atlasleave the friend at home okay there's two there's two just absolutely egregious things going on here the two hours late egregious bringing the friend egregious um
01:04:40
Brian Atlasso he up I that guy's an idiot yeah and he lost his chance with me so yeah I mean fair enough I think it's at at the end of the day though better find
01:04:51
Brian Atlasout sooner that the dude has like a room like a two-digit IQ absolutely I'm sorry but if you're 2 hours late and then you're asking to bring a friend there's you may very well
01:05:03
Nickbe can I put a situation out there though cuz I have to right you are you really are you about to make a to she's about to Devil's Advocate I am going to
01:05:15
Katieyou why was he late did you ask why he was late who knows maybe this oh I can't say that word on here but maybe his friend really needed a friend he was in one of those times and he couldn't be alone and so his friend was actually a
01:05:26
Katiereally good friend was like sorry go bring my buddy with me like do we ask him why why was he 2 hours late we cannot make judgments without I don't I don't care about people's problems when you're going on a date like if you're 2 hours late and you're having a problem
01:05:39
Jakeif you're having some anxiety or whatever it is just pull out on the date just say hey can't come yeah yeah communication is definitely key oh I want to I want to ask some more clarifying details on that did he so
01:05:51
Brian Atlaswhat what was the time of the date so originally it was supposed to be at 8:00 p.m. okay um he showed up at 10:00 so question so um originally it was it at 8:00 p.m. did you show up at 8:00 p.m. so he was picking me up from my house I
01:06:04
Brian Atlaswas ready at my house okay so you were at okay so you were at your house um you weren't going to meet there at what point prior to 8:00 p.m. did he text you saying hey I'm running like did he make it very clear here I can meet at 10:
01:06:16
Lilyp.m. he texted me around 7 saying he was going to be an hour late and then you know the hour late comes by and he's like another hour okay I mean it's it's
01:06:26
Brian Atlasat least good that he told you an hour in advance that he was going to be late cuz some people will like you could have gone to the place and he he's texting
01:06:38
Brian Atlasyou at 8:00 p.m. you're already there oh I'm an hour late so I mean still though still um okay so then so he picked you up at 10 so he end up being two hours L and yeah and so we
01:06:50
Lilyget to the bowling alley at 11: right and there's an hour wait and and the thing or not we don't get there at 11:00 we get there at like 10:05 1010 but the bowling alley closes at 11: and there's
01:06:59
Lilyan hour wait so we couldn't Bowl so I said okay just take me home then so me him and his friend are just chatting in this car as he takes me home and that was the date it was like oh so the day was like 10 20 minutes 20 minutes literally can I throw another situation
01:07:12
Katieout there wait before you do it did he try did he like try to smash yeah he said you want to go inside and drink some wine and go kick it I said no yikes okay go ahead okay I was just about to say I was going to say did it occur to
01:07:24
Katieyou maybe you were the Third on their date oh my God you're genius no what uh highly unlikely but highly
01:07:36
Lilyunlikely that was not the case but I don't know I think again communication and honesty if you know you're going to be late just tell me straight up or just pull out like be for real I'm busy I got
01:07:45
Brian Atlastime I got classes to study for like don't waste my time I'm being safe I pull out I agree you should always
01:07:54
Brian Atlaspull out it's the safe okay anyways good okay sorry guys I'm sorry I'm sorry um okay wow uh how did we get there we were talking about effort if I recall oh yeah sorry yeah I was asking okay ladies
01:08:06
Brian Atlasladies all right All These Guys these terrible American men they're not putting in enough effort I think the question was what are women doing in terms of their effort during those
01:08:18
Brian Atlasinitial stages what do women do initially to build a relationship [Music]
01:08:28
KaylaCricket starting over here talk well she answered sort of she said good communication taking the gifts yeah ex you're accepting if he wasn't pursuing
01:08:40
Kaylait and I wanted to what would I be doing well let's say there's a mutual level of Interest yeah mutual level of interest and you guys are going on what's his part what you said like I'm going to
01:08:50
Kaylapick you up at this time pursuing like okay okay so I guess I would just ask him like meaningful questions and remember them and do a little thoughtful things
01:09:06
Lilyokay my love language is acts of service so I feel like I'll counter if someone does something for me I'll be like oh let me do something for you but that's also just how I show my love so like if a guy shows up with flowers on one date the next date maybe you know I make you
01:09:18
Shaydinner like it's like a little back and forth you know sweet okay all right this some better answers yeah I agree with that um like I said before I like getting flowers I don't expect flowers
01:09:28
Shayon the first date but I do think that if a man put it puts in that investment that investment does come back whether um you know that relationship continues
01:09:38
Shayme getting him gifts on a higher degree than flowers uh like Lily said cooking dinner um it comes back in a different way I think that men have this is my opinion I know a lot of people disagree
01:09:50
Shaywith that I think men have a not a role but certain things that they can do to get a woman and a woman has her part like giving him loyalty during that
01:09:59
Shaytalking stage um you know being free for him we are busy too you know um so making time for those dates helping plan those dates doing dates that he enjoys
01:10:10
Shaylike finding out his hobbies and doing the things that he likes getting to know him um that's the effort we put in during that like talking stage good answer okay that was a good answer especially the being loyal during that
01:10:22
Jakeinitial stage that's uh I concur with that so and the thoughtful things I think both of you guys said that was good good times hold on how
01:10:34
Arianaabout oh did you have or did you guys have anything over here do you guys have anything to add about what what a lady should do I think she said it all I think she said it all I would just say a big one
01:10:45
Vanikais just being there like emotionally and physically but yeah yeah I do also believe in equal efforts from both the side one time a person is paying I would say next time
01:10:56
VanikaI'm I'm ready and I would love to do that for him if I see he's doing things for me and also yeah the time I would say time is the most important and like
01:11:07
Vanikabeing nice and like showing him like I'm really interested in him yeah if I am that's why I'm pursuing it like for like further just not like killing his time and just showing him like kind mostly
01:11:20
Brian Atlaslike I've seen this oh just show the less and TR then why you dating mhm okay just yeah sure I have some pre-show some of you were able to provide some pre-show notes so I'm just going to go
01:11:30
Brian Atlasover some of those pre-show notes uh your your name's pronounced vanica yes you can call me v v okay V for fetta got it should we get the mask I have the guy
01:11:41
VanikaFox mask you said you were recently in the love triangle yeah it was kind of love triangle I was hanging out with like a group I had like friends so it was I was spending a lot of time I I
01:11:53
Vanikawould say just my free time I was just spending with the guy and yeah my my girlfriend used to like him too so it stuck in the middle I would say that so
01:12:04
Vanikait was one guy you and your friend so he was stuck in the middle yeah yeah so he was sleeping with you and your friend no it's I didn't say about sleeping I just
01:12:14
Brian Atlassaid about liking oh liking yeah well did he like either of you so I would say he was more into me but but but yeah it didn't work out
01:12:25
Vanikaor no actually weal about it and he he want to date a girl who actually willing to marry because he thinks he's 30 he's well settled so he want to get married and I said I'm 24 my struggling life has
01:12:37
Vanikajust started here so I don't I can't commit to you so it's better to not say it you just find your goal whatever you're looking for okay you do want to get married
01:12:49
Brian Atlaseventually correct yeah but not currently I would say kids eventually yes sure gotcha you also said no one should fake orgasms now here's the interesting part
01:13:00
Brian Atlasone guy that you dated did yeah the past one I would say and so you're curious if guys do that he faked it he faked the dude faked the orgasm
01:13:11
Vanikaum wow I'm did he tell you why and how did you know I just know it you just if you know about a girl you know about a boy too huh you know it just you know
01:13:23
Vanikas into the mic if you can I think you just know it you just once or like once or twice it's okay I don't know it but later on you you eventually know it what was his face facial expression could you
01:13:36
Nickexplain re I don't want to go into the deep but yeah okay eventually you know it you're really quiet so can you make sure you're really on the mic it's can you hear me now you can scoot the chair a little closer to the two like sit ups
01:13:48
Nickon the top bit body hate we need it I would say you knew it if you are sleeping with that guy okay Jake have you ever faked an orgasm no I wouldn't even know how to I'm not
01:13:59
Nickthat good after I couldn't do it I feel like most guys don't have trouble and no like why would you it's it's that's a bizarre thing for
01:14:10
Nicklike if you don't you don't you have you ever once have you well once you what all right Spencer what about you nope nope all right how bet you Brian you
01:14:21
Brian Atlashave a faked one no no never faked one no I thought about it you never just wanted it to be over yeah but I can usually bring myself
01:14:30
Brian Atlasto climax if I do want it to be over yeah you know so okay that's interes your eyes yeah yeah I wouldn't fake it like I would either just be like all right let's just stop I'm tired let's
01:14:42
Jakejust stop say it then or I would just so okay did you reckon he had like a kink for faking it like he felt a bit naughty like he could get away with it sorry I didn't understand that do you think that it was like a kink for him
01:14:53
Vanikayou know I don't know felt why he start doing it if he don't want it like and then think think maybe he was gay that that is possible I would say
01:15:05
VanikaI'm like less into all these dating hairs so this is possible was there a in the wrist when he walked no no no nothing like that nothing like that so going around the table I I think this
01:15:16
Unknownis probably pretty rare but has a guy ever faked an orgasm with you uh no
01:15:23
Brian Atlasno no no no no going back around this way have you ever faked an O go ahead
01:15:35
Unknownyes okay yes maybe yes no yes no wait so so that was yes for everyone besides you
01:15:45
Brian Atlasexcept for the two Liars you said no okay I have a question right I think a c maybe one or two of you said good communication is important important do you guys think good communication is important yeah well hold on just a
01:15:57
Brian Atlassecond here yeah don't women often criticize men are just these terrible communicators men don't
01:16:05
Brian Atlascommunicate but in a very important uh aspect of relationships why is it that y'all be faking orgasms what is going on
01:16:16
Brian Atlasyou said relationships in a relationship I've never I've never faked an orgasm okay just with the Casual sexual encounters with hot sexy
01:16:25
Brian AtlasEuropeans I'm not that's not a roast I'm just maybe it's okay good for you all right have fun because it helps them to
01:16:36
Katiefinish okay makes a bit more sense that's a fair point I still don't think you should do it though but um do you understand though you're not a woman you don't know exactly how it all works in
01:16:46
Katiethere so sometimes it doesn't always go there so and you might like be satisfied in your feeling and your situation and still want to give them so
01:16:59
Brian Atlasyou're saying it's a charitable act truth Uber Alice the truth is the most important give me the I I I don't want I want the truth always okay so you rather
01:17:10
Brian Atlasthan stop and say I'm sorry you're not doing a good job and your just not it you don't you don't want that you don't want that no I don't want that okay but like I don't I don't the truth would be
01:17:21
Nicka girl not faking an orgasm and so what would the truth be would be her sto the orgasm becomes non-existent huh the orgasm ceases to exist there is no yeah just you don't
01:17:32
Brian Atlaslie yeah the truth would be not committing an act of and if you I mean is that if if your partner was failing to pleasure you is that how you would go
01:17:42
Brian Atlasabout in a intimate sexual setting just kind of bluntly and ruthlessly just saying yeah you kind of suck I don't think that be I don't think that would be like huh if they weren't doing
01:17:54
Katiea good job on me yeah then I would say something well how would you say it I would just be like this is no this isn't feeling good like I don't like this
01:18:03
Brian Atlaslet's try something else wait what's the last part let's try something else oh let's try something wait when you say this isn't feeling good are you communicating that like it's it's
01:18:14
Katiepainful or discomforting or it's just you're not feeling pleasure or sensation they're just you know not hitting it they're not knowing what they're doing or it's just not what you want maybe
01:18:26
Katiethey're really into doing something and you want them to do something else okay so how would you go about uh telling the
01:18:36
Brian Atlasperson you would just tell them well how because cuz there's a I'm sure there's a diplomatic way and then there's like a way that would like totally kill the mood yeah yeah there is and that happens
01:18:49
Brian Atlassometimes and there's also like so wait you you me that's I mean I might yeah I have because they aren't precisely hitting the correct spot in that precise the mood is killed it's hard to come back up you know well isn't it you
01:19:01
Katiekilling the mood it might be well would because I want it might be a little selfish but if I'm not feeling it and it's just not going good and I'm just
01:19:09
Brian Atlaslike okay I'm not into this anymore so if it's like momentarily not feeling good like if you're not continuously feeling pleasure you're
01:19:21
Jakejust going to like abruptly stop the sex no or have you ever have you ever had that situation with somebody who you have a deeper connection with somebody that you've been on been on dates with been in a
01:19:33
Katierelationship with and you've had to kill the mood with those people yes that' be awkward better than faking orgasms right
01:19:44
Jakeand just sitting there being like Oh there's also like a nice like what do you want you guys are so difficult to like what you want wait men are difficult to please apparently what you want well but it's not about but you
01:19:56
Katiejust said it's not about our pleasure no I did not say that let's Rec I did not no you said you said if you were not yes I advocate for myself I'm a self
01:20:05
Brian AtlasAdvocate but I'm not saying that no but you but I'm confused why you're saying well men are so difficult to please but you abruptly ending the sexual encounter
01:20:17
Brian Atlasor interrupting the sexual encounter it seems strictly because of your lack of specific pleasure in that specific moment it's not just like a one little like oh you messed up for one moment
01:20:28
Jakethat's it but if you're trying and you say h let's try something else and that's like do you think maybe you're not attracted to the person though huh do you think maybe you're not attracted to the person sounds like you're very worried about the physical feeling but
01:20:40
Jakeif you're sharing that intimacy with somebody who you actually care about that's that that situation is not going to occur where you're where you're just so off it because you're sharing something very intimate do you think you maybe just don't don't like the person you should
01:20:53
Jakebe careful I think that's true I think that there's sometimes that you're just not into that do you think you may be a little bit too worried about the physical pleasure and sensation rather
01:21:02
Jakethan the actual act that you're engaging in no fair enough thank you I think I was saying something about
01:21:12
Brian Atlascommunication being important mm y'all can't you got to stop faking orgasms guys you can't be fakeing orgasms just let the guy take the L and then you know you know
01:21:23
Brian Atlaslet him take the yell you know I think especially but I I don't understand the logic of well in a relationship I wouldn't and I I don't know if that was everyone's response but I know you said that but in a casual encounter sure I
01:21:35
Brian Atlasguess I'll fake an orgasm well it would occur to me wouldn't it not that I think you should fake it in a relationship but wouldn't it make like if you don't give a about this casual encounter person why bother
01:21:47
Toiato fake an orgasm I think it's like the killing the mood thing it's just like if if you're having a good time with someone like I don't know and it's just like you're
01:21:56
TTS Readernot oh sorry GD One Motorsports donated $200 not really sure which Waffle House you picked up these ladies but maybe try IOP next time all this talk of
01:22:09
Brian Atlascommunication and they can't even express what gets them off sake mate they want to know thank you g one um well it is an interesting point I mean you often hear women uh you know
01:22:21
Toiathat they often say they wish men communicated better men are poor communicators but also it's you know y'all be faking orgasms I think that's poor communication well you're talking vers sexually versus planning dates and stuff you're trying to compare two forms
01:22:35
Brian Atlasof communication well I mean I think when we're talking about communication we can talk about all sorts of things but like I I think we can all agree sex is sex is an important part of a relationship and if you're not uh you're not being
01:22:48
Brian Atlassatisfied and you know you can but you're not communicated and you're defaulting to here let me fake an orgasm that's not you're not communicating uh your lack of receiving
01:23:00
Toiapleasure and being able to climax yeah but look like if you're traveling you know you're never going to see this person again you're having a good time where you guys are friends you know you're leaving the next day are you really going to sit there I mean maybe this is healthy but like Sit Them Down
01:23:13
Toiabe like okay this is actually really what I like this is what makes me comfortable these are my boundaries blah blah blah if you're having a moment and stuff I mean either fake the orgasm or don't fake orgasm okay fine but if it's in a relationship with something more
01:23:26
Toiaserious something that you know you're going to see the this person again then I think it's very important to communicate and yeah yeah communicate yeah I mean I I certainly
01:23:37
Brian Atlasagree that it would be more important to not fake orgasms if this is somebody that you're pursuing for a long-term relationship versus I suppose I don't have a super strong objection if you're
01:23:49
Brian Atlasjust if it's a casual encounter although I'm not really in favor of casual encounters but um uh at least from my point of view I to me it's like what's
01:23:59
Brian Atlasthe point um it's not something I'm particularly interested in but uh I think even in a casual encounter you could be like and it doesn't the communication I mean it's just like
01:24:11
Brian Atlascould just be like rub my clip this way or you know whatever yeah I don't know true word word has anybody here faked an orgasm in a relationship or with some
01:24:22
Arianasomebody who you wanted to pursue a potential relationship with no anybody your husband it was only the first time but I communicated it to him
01:24:34
Arianaafterwards yeah so we talked about it and we we fixed it so yeah but I just felt scared in the moment I didn't want to say anything because I didn't want to hurt his feelings obviously it's the first time so
01:24:46
Brian Atlasyeah good to know good to know did you have something Katie no okay all right let's see we have some more notes here um last thing with you you said you believe if you feel attracted towards
01:24:59
Vanikasomeone you should just come clean with your intentions on the first date if you want to have sex just say it yeah I would say like just don't play with the feelings like you want to have like a oh I want to take it more further you want
01:25:12
Vanikato just hook up just say it I'm not I'm not ready for it I don't want to do it I will say you straight to your face no don't put efforts don't don't go on more dates because I'm not going to do that but I think don't play with the feelings and don't make it like more forward
01:25:25
Brian Atlasdates and like more hanging out you should be clear with the intention whatever you want you want to okay so if I want to go around the table on this starting with you
01:25:36
Brian Atlasuh are you on dating apps yeah I am on Bumble BFF okay hinge or anything Tinder or anything like um let's say it's like very early on when you've met a guy
01:25:49
Brian Atlasmaybe it's maybe you met him in person maybe you met him on the dating app and fairly early on in the interaction he does exactly what you've suggested
01:26:00
Brian Atlasexactly what you've recommended a guy just point blank says uh I'm trying to think the best way a guy could phrase this uh he's just like hey I think
01:26:10
Brian Atlasyou're cute do you want to have sex you going to go for it no okay what about you m if you weren't married of course of course if a guy went up to
01:26:22
Arianaif a guy went up to me and asked me hey you're cute want to have sex what would I say yeah no I don't think I'd like that same I think like in theory that's
01:26:34
Shaya good practice like so we don't get screwed over but um like realistically if a if I came to a date in in the back of my mind I was like okay sleeping with this man I would never sleep with the
01:26:46
Shayman if he like outright just said I want to sleep with you I think you're cute I think when you come to these dates um um there's a sense of what both people are trying to get out of that first
01:27:00
Brian Atlasencounter uh personally I would say no just cuz I don't go on dates just to sleep with people what if you just went to have sex just have sex with them if I was just going to have sex with them and they
01:27:11
Brian Atlassaid yeah you want to have sex then yeah okay I think it just depends on your intention going into the date like if I just so just just to be clear if a guy up front was like hey do you want to
01:27:22
Lilyhave sex and you'd be you'd be open to that is it a pre-planned datee or is this a random guy coming to me on the street uh it depends on like do I know the guy like what's the background context with this guy match have you
01:27:35
Lilybeen on the dating app I have been on a matched with him on the dating app you think he's attractive had a little Pleasant back and forth that's the extent of it and if my intention was to hook up with this man and he said that then we're on the same page isn't that
01:27:48
Lilyyour intention though yeah if that's my intention then yes but not all of my my intentions on a dating app is just as sleep with people so so okay so so long as he asks it up front but if he were to
01:27:58
Lilyask you like on a date just to grab some food and then he asked it then you would object it depends on if my intentions going on that date was to sleep with him or if it was to get to know him and like you know like further advance that more
01:28:10
Katieinto a relationship okay what about you no if they walked that like no I mean
01:28:20
Toiathere'd be need to be more that there's okay got it what about you same um yeah no unless yeah no wait so okay you match with a guy on you've been on the dating
01:28:31
Brian Atlasapp like once once okay long time ago did you go out partying at all here no here no um okay uh and most of the ones
01:28:41
Toiathat come up and say that it's like no okay it's like it's not my intention see I'm not really like that's that's not attractive to me if I was at a state of my life and and I know that there's many
01:28:53
Toiapeople out there who yeah like they just want to have sex and sex is fun for that and you know they're vibing with a person and they're like okay do you want to go have sex then yeah but I'm personally like that's not where I'm at
01:29:05
Brian Atlasright now would it be too forward you think like if a guy just straight up asked you hey do you want to have sex not in a creepy way but just like in the most you know
01:29:14
Toiajust normal way you can ask somebody what if he was really super duper hot super duper if he was super duper hot and I wanted to have sex just sex I didn't see him as anything else and I
01:29:28
Jakethink that's super yeah that's great what if you wanted more though like if I wanted more then no see the problem is that you girls always think about some creepy guy in a big big coat you think about this question we're talking about Chads no we don't I'm thinking about
01:29:40
KatieChads I mean maybe it's because of my age because I'm 29 but yeah I think about the little okay college boys that are okay um wait but so
01:29:52
Brian Atlashold on just to be clear so wait a guy that you would want to have a relationship with you would want to wait to have sex 100% yes this is we I want
01:30:03
Brian Atlasto go around the table on that one but but if there was just some like hot dude and uh I'm trying to think how I frame this
01:30:17
Brian Atlasquestion H he was just straight up wanted to have sex he communicated it you you'd also go for that you'd just have the quick casual sex if I wanted a
01:30:29
Toiarelationship with him well if you didn't I suppose and all I wanted was sex at that moment yes okay at that moment if all you wanted was sex okay I'm at the time
01:30:42
Toiain my life where I don't want to date and it's a guy and I'm friends with and I don't see him as anything more than a friend or like like I just know I don't want to have a relationship with him like that but you know there's some banter there's some tension he's like
01:30:55
Brian Atlasokay I really like I think you're really attractive like I I want to have sex and that's what I wanted then yes I see I have something for this Nick if you can start look pulling it up it's in the Dropbox folder it's f8 it's a like a
01:31:08
Brian AtlasReddit thread we can react to it's next to the picture of Molly um it's a black it's a like a black screen grab from Reddit f8l in the just just the first
01:31:20
Brian AtlasDropbox folder I mean you don't need to show it to us but uh get that pulled up and then what about you a guy I know you're in a relationship right now let's assume you
01:31:31
Brian Atlaswere single or back when you were single guy walks up to you or maybe matches with you on a dating app it's just hey I think you're cute do you want to have sex yay or
01:31:40
Kaylano probably from the dating app even if he was really hot not the first time just because I'm going to assume that that's how all his dates go and that's kind of gross because to me it's like
01:31:51
Kaylaexchanging Souls like way more than just having sex it's kind of like giving a piece which I feel fine but like receiving I don't know what I'm
01:32:02
Kaylareceiving wait I'm like I don't I don't want to get really into it it's kind of spiritual but just
01:32:10
Kaylacooties talking like St STDs I mean that and like I don't know I'm just very like this is my temple and I don't want bad
01:32:21
Kaylaenergy from someone I don't know very well even your body is your temple yeah okay um so how long do you think and I will return I do want to return to the
01:32:31
Kaylawhole uh you know waiting how long do you think you should wait before having sex with somebody I don't know kind of when you
01:32:41
Kaylaknow you know like if I really like the guy and I see potential and I want to keep hanging out with him then of course I would you you would sooner rather than
01:32:53
Kaylalater yeah okay I see so what if you're on the you're like a fence on the fence about the guy on offense I don't know if youc proba would still yeah I'd be okay with having sex even though I was kind
01:33:05
Kaylaof like uh maybe well your current boyfriend how was it the first date no second date yeah mhm second date but there was a lot of time between them because we
01:33:17
Brian Atlasmet one day when I was still living in Missouri and then he went back to California okay all right um so Nick were you don't pull it up yet
01:33:29
Brian Atlasbut do you you have it okay we'll react to that in just a sec so um I think the point was so actually we'll go around the table on that how long do you think we you should wait
01:33:42
Toiabefore having sex with somebody how long do you like to wait I like to wait if I actually see a potential of a relationship and I want to be in a relationship I wait a while I would say more than the average person you so if
01:33:54
Brian Atlasyou see a potential for a relationship and I want a relationship you'll wait yes coincidingly though if you don't see a potential for a
01:34:03
Brian Atlasrelationship you will um you're you're willing to have sex
01:34:13
Brian Atlasimmediately uh if I'm like traveling and yeah I want to have experiences yes okay so when you're travel if I want want sex yes you just were traveling correct you were in Europe you you said you were in
01:34:24
Brian AtlasSpain did you go to any other countries or just stuck okay um okay so if you're just traveling so you are you you don't have any uh qualms with having sex with
01:34:36
Brian Atlassomeone immediately like okay while you were in Europe like was there just like some some dude maybe you're at a party or something I don't know and like an hour
01:34:47
Brian Atlasan hour later like you guys are hooking up yeah okay um so okay but if you if you mark the
01:34:57
Brian Atlasperson as somebody you want to have something longterm with then how do you have a sense of how long you'd like to wait dep depends on the person do you have an estimate like a couple weeks
01:35:10
Brian Atlascouple couple dates couple months it's I've done a couple months before you've done a couple months before okay is that recently or wait but I thought you you oh no you did have a
01:35:20
Brian Atlasone- yearold that one your one relation when you're correct when was the how old were you when you had the one year relationship 18 18 was this in high school or was
01:35:32
Brian Atlaslike the end end of high school okay now prior to the one-year relationship um did you have any of those experiences or was just kind of more fun and no not really okay so your one-year
01:35:44
Brian Atlasrelationship was that the first guy that you had ever been with first guy I've ever had sex with okay first guy you ever had sex with okay so I mean that changes things a little bit because I mean so you were
01:35:56
Brian Atlaswas your first time having sex you were a virgin so you waited a little bit um but after that relationship um you're more open to just having sex
01:36:07
Toiaimmediately I'm still not really that type of person well you just said like if I'm traveling and stuff not if I'm not but I'm not looking wonder why we don't want to traveling I'm not but I'm
01:36:18
ToiaI'm you know I'm living in a place for you know four or six months I know that like it's not going to be a long-term relationship for me with my go it's not going to work out like I see it's it's not like I'm going out there and I'm
01:36:30
Toialooking for people to hook up with if there's right you know if you had a long-term boyfriend would you go traveling yes by yourself mhm do you think that he would be reasonable to have objections to that uh hopefully he
01:36:42
Jakewouldn't or he would travel with me but but you would go traveling by yourself though I would with a with a boyfriend 100% And he and he's at home I mean if
01:36:51
Toiahe doesn't want to come yeah also it's healthy to have those things I would not give up traveling at
01:36:59
Toiathis point in my life for to stay at home to be in a relationship okay um so I'm curious so for example like you
01:37:10
Brian Atlasjust were traveling it sounds like you just had some of these shortterm like casual experiences um now that you're how long have you been back here in s Barbara in
01:37:21
Brian AtlasCalifornia or non s just back home a month you've been back home a month okay um less than a month or what Oh I thought you were like shaking your head or something like oh no I was just cracking my neck oh okay okay um just
01:37:35
Brian Atlasokay so you've been now that you're back here are you
01:37:44
Brian Atlastrying the next G okay you the guy the next guy that you put potentially see as having a relationship with are you going
01:37:54
Brian Atlasto want to wait to have sex with him yes okay just off of the back of having a string of short uh like immediate casual sexual encounters I mean there weren't
01:38:05
Brian Atlasthat many but yeah yeah if you don't mind me asking how many over the last six months
01:38:13
Brian Atlasyeah like four like four five plus orus no plus or minus
01:38:20
Brian Atlasokay okay at least four um do you is it conceivable that that guy who you are who that guy who you are potentially
01:38:30
Brian Atlaseyeballing for a long-term relationship and let's say he wants to have sex but you're like no no no I want a long-term I I want I really like you I I want it I
01:38:42
Brian Atlaswant it to be serious if he knows that you you're previous standard was well when I'm in Europe I'll the guy immediately do you anticipate that a guy might
01:38:54
Toiaobject to that I hope that he wouldn't I hope he would respect my boundaries and also but do you realize that he you only have boundaries for him though also when you guys say immediately and have sex
01:39:07
Toiaimmediately that's not always what happened in Europe like a lot of the time when I say casual was like friends that turned into more not relationships but you know more than that it's not like I I don't know well but it sounded like I mean I asked you I think if you
01:39:20
Jakeknow you had had hooked up within like an hour of meeting somebody that happened twice twice right so then your boyfriend's gonna have that standard in mind when he when he wants to he's
01:39:33
Brian Atlasgetting different treatment yeah yeah because the guys in Europe I wasn't pursuing long-term relationships with but he I am it almost occurs to me though if this is somebody that you see
01:39:43
Brian Atlasfor long-term with long-term potential wouldn't wouldn't that be the guy who's more deserving of having like H sleeping with sooner no
01:39:56
Brian Atlaslike wouldn't you but if you like really like the guy wouldn't you want to have sex with him I would cuz to me it seems like you're almost gamifying it's like you're playing a game no no I
01:40:08
Brian Atlaswould definitely want to have so what why would you if you don't have any sort of objections to sleeping with somebody fast cuz you don't um why would you make
01:40:19
Toiaa potential boyfriend wait to have sex because I would wait want to make sure that we're in a relationship that's based on much more than just sex or much more than just my body but why can't you
01:40:30
Brian Atlassimultaneously like you're using it as like a carrot on the stick why can't you simultaneously build a relationship and have sex at the same time you definitely can but I would just wait but you have you have no like moral objections to
01:40:43
Brian Atlassleeping with someone quickly so I just don't understand like it's not like you're religious and you're waiting until marriage because that's like your moral or religious point of view yeah can I
01:40:54
Toiapitch in well I'd like to okay but you can add to it in a bit but I'm trying to get an answer from her well for me I mean sex like it is it is very meaningful even yes even when I've
01:41:07
Brian Atlashooked yes it is okay it is for me sex is Meaningful but so why the different standard for shouldn't if it is if that is the case why engage in casual sexual encounters because I'm on a different
01:41:18
Toiaside of the world I'm 20 I'm living life I want to experience that I haven't done it before I want to experience hookup culture it was fine like okay you know but it's for
01:41:30
Toiame like a long-term relationship that's serious okay and I just I want to really get to know the person I want to make sure that we're compatible intellectually compatible emotionally compatible you know like that and that
01:41:41
Brian Atlasalso makes the sex better having but all those things you listed if you were to have sex with them on the same timeline that you've had sex with these casual encounters that
01:41:53
Jakewouldn't preclude you from any of those other things that you want to uh explore with a partner can I give a one example ABS absolutely so how would you feel if so if would you prefer someone to buy
01:42:05
Jakeyou a really nice gift an expensive gift or take you for a weekend away take me for a weekend away okay how would you feel if you were dating a guy and all you wanted was for him to take you for a nice weekend away but he made you wait 3
01:42:16
Toiamonths and then you found out that five other girls he took them for a nice weekend away straight away how would that make you feel I mean I would just ask him why did you take like what is it about me that made you not want to take me away if this is what you were doing with all the
01:42:29
Jakeother girls i' be like oh maybe I'm not like all the other girls then you know well it's kind of a special thing to take someone away for a weekend so would you feel that maybe he doesn't have the same sort of burning desire to spend
01:42:40
Jakethat time with you I mean I'd have to communicate with him about it but don't know don't you think like logically that would mean that he doesn't have the desire to want to spend that time with you straight away
01:42:51
Jakeno cuz for us it's like a woman's body is very sacred so if I want to be in a relationship with a girl and she says to me you're going to wait if you're Logan Paul though and like she and you find out that she's slept with a bunch of
01:43:04
Jakedifferent guys straight away then you're going to feel like she just doesn't really have that desire for you did you see the whole Logan Paul situation no so Logan Paul's um wife they went on podcast together and she was saying how
01:43:16
Jakeoh we made him I made him wait I made him wait and he he was saying yeah like that's how I knew she was the one and then he was fighting a guy and then the guy Dylan Dennis came out with all these photos of all these guys that she'd been
01:43:28
Jakewith and turns out she hadn't exactly been so um tempered with her with her body before that so then Logan Paul got taken the P these are different people like in my life it's someone who I have
01:43:40
Toiaa deeper connection with and I want to you know I want to have that deep connection with versus you know a night out in Europe like it's just a whole different realm so you're you're thinking it from it very much from your perspective though it's kind of I'm not
01:43:53
Jakereally hearing much empathy with how the guy might feel because whether they admit it or not like us guys have big egos right so when we have our girl if we find out that she's given it away to God's really easily beforehand with us
01:44:05
Jakeand then she made us wait it looks it makes us look like a mug and then other people when they see that like if I saw my mate and he was with a girl and she and he's like yeah man I think she's the one she's making me wait and then Brian
01:44:17
Jakewas like no I hit it first night that would I would think that like my friend was like a bit of a mug getting made to wait like that really so guys kind guys have that politics and maybe you're not aware of it but I think
01:44:29
Brian Atlasit depends ony you have to think about the man the ego of the man that you I think it depends on the ego of the man well and here's I mean to add to what Jake is saying it's kind of like the way we might view it is you know women often for example might complain about
01:44:41
Brian Atlasboys right so you reward the boys who will never give you commitment with immediate sex and you're going to punish the guys worthy of a relation relationship and you by making them wait
01:44:52
Brian Atlasweeks months or even until marriage and look ultimately it it's certainly your prerogative if you want to have a 100 previous sexual partners you ALS you slept with them uh 100 previous 100
01:45:05
Brian Atlasprevious sexual partners you slept with them on the first date and then the next guy it's we're waiting until marriage that's 100% you're right we're coming at
01:45:14
Brian Atlasit from the guy's perspective of hey 100% you're right if you that was your previous standard all the other guys you slept with immediately now you want to make me wait for marriage that's your
01:45:25
Brian Atlasright but we're going to view that in a certain type of way of like you're not the girl for a lot of guys are going to feel a certain type of way about that they're going to have an issue with that Y and it it does it does seem to me to
01:45:37
Brian Atlasbe I don't know if it's uh it's a bit of a double standard to some degree like you have not not in the typical sense of a double standard but you have one standard for this cohort of men and a
01:45:47
Lilydifferent standard for another cohort of men um um so yeah can I make a comment on something you guys said sure so um when you guys were talking about like you know she's the one because she
01:45:58
Lilywaited to sleep with you maybe that's why like a lot of women I think also if I'm trying to pursue a guy in a relationship I want like a lot of guys perspectives are oh she's going to make me wait so she's the one if I'm trying
01:46:11
Lilyto pursue this guy I want to be the one you know so I'll be like oh it will show a good up like it's a good foot forward if I don't sleep with them on the first date because that means when I'm in him I want to hear about him it's not just
01:46:23
Jakeabout sex for yeah I'd say I'd say you you've got a good point in terms of the fact that you want to present yourself as somebody who's a long-term partner yeah however you have to be very wary of your past coming back to bite you in
01:46:35
Jakethat regard in terms of if he find if he's a proud guy and he finds out that actually in fact you didn't make other people wait then that's going to be an issue but if you're somebody who has a track record of not of of making people
01:46:47
Jakewait or if you're somebody who saving themselves till marri Mar for example then a God is going to really respect that okay I guess yeah um I think that it sets up a completely different Dynamic what you choose to do so if you're um Sleeping with a guy in the
01:47:01
Shayfirst day and you know you don't want anything serious you're letting him know that um when you I think there's an understanding when you're going into a date or pursuing someone in a relationship that both of you are waiting sure one more person might be
01:47:13
Shayeager but there's an understanding that you're getting to know one another um in the past like if I've slept with someone earlier um after getting getting to know them that never results in a relationship that leads into a
01:47:23
Jakesituationship or friends with benefits and I think that waiting structures a successful relation I get it but I guess I I I do get what you're saying and you know you do want to set a precedent but
01:47:35
Jakeyou can't really have your cake and eat it because if that's not your standard all the time then it can't be your standard for me and my personal standards and like a lot of the guys who I know would would be the exact same like that so are you saying that if you
01:47:48
Shayever did a one night stand in your life that you no longer um should you shouldn't have you're not up to standards to have a relationship
01:47:58
Shayif the girl wants to wait if you once in your life had a one night stand and then you meet someone that you want to pursue a relationship with and she wants to wait but you didn't wait in the past if
01:48:10
Jakeher standard was that she always M always makes people wait and if I and if she didn't respect the fact that I had had one night stands then that would be fair enough if she didn't want to do that okay
01:48:21
TTS Readerneous donated $200 hello to all I wonder where the podcast will go this time that is a good
01:48:29
Brian Atlasquestion who knows who knows where where it will go maybe someone will uh pull out no I do see a point I think
01:48:41
Jakea lot of guys would say oh yeah men and women are different and men and women are different in that regard when it comes to promiscuity and sleeping around but I would say that if if I met a woman and she was like a woman of high moral principle and she said I've waited so
01:48:54
Shaymuch and I've I've resisted so much Temptation and you've done this this and that sorry I would understand because my past has come back to bite me sure but do you feel you yourself feel like these
01:49:05
Jakeone night stands made you ineligible for a good relationship they probably did affect it yeah okay definitely definitely even like guys are different I do think that guys are different to
01:49:17
Jakegirls in that regard but I would say that definitely if if you look at like a person who's like a really devout Christian or Muslim the whole life and they wait till marriage then they're going to be of a different they're going
01:49:30
Jaketo think about sex and relationships and everything very differently but the world that we live in we're surrounded by so much Temptation and so much freedom and liberty and Yas Queen and and everything that it's it's very hard
01:49:40
Jaketo sort of fend off that temp Temptation sometimes so yeah that's what I'd say about that yeah and I mean uh as far as
01:49:51
Brian Atlasand I I think there's certainly a scope to it too I mean you said if a girl had one one night stand and then moving on from there her new standard became well I'm going to wait for all my future Partners I think that's a little
01:50:04
Brian Atlasdifferent than a girl who's perhaps had multiple casual engagements say she has had 10 20 30 of the 10 20 30 guys she's had sex with that she all did it immediately then oh this is the guy I
01:50:16
Brian Atlaswant to be in a relationship with I want to wait 3 months 90day rule or something like that it's it doesn't come across as like an actual authentic standard it just seems like
01:50:28
Brian Atlasyou've just totally and it's your prerogative to shift but we're not saying women shouldn't be allowed to do that and of course you
01:50:38
Brian Atlasshould if you want to change for the better fantastic but don't expect men to accept your past we also have a right to discernment and judgment just as you do
01:50:51
Brian Atlasuh and we're allowed to have preferences standards and boundaries so did you have something on this um yes okay I just lost my train of thought though oh I can keep going and then if you want to think about it keep going sure yeah so I have
01:51:03
Brian Atlasa couple examples here that I could give you that might be able to like paint it a little bit so um here's an analogy sort of the inverse the telling your
01:51:14
Brian Atlasdate that so all the EX's got five star meals but she gets McDonald's because you've turned over a new leaf and decided that money has better uses than just trying to impress people
01:51:26
Brian Atlasthat's one example so you're on the date with a guy you know you know that he took all his previous ex-girlfriends that he dated all the other girls he's seen on these really elaborate really
01:51:37
Brian Atlasnice dinners and he's he doesn't have any Financial issues or anything um he took them on fantastic dinners spent 100 200 bucks but he takes you to
01:51:47
ShayMcDonald's I have something to say to that what if that man was fine with taking all these women out to nice's dinners because he didn't want anything with this girl and then he finds a girl he likes and he wants to make sure she's
01:51:59
Shaynot a gold digger so he takes her to McDonald's that's exactly what women are saying that um sometimes so so you would you you'd be cool with that is what
01:52:10
Jakeyou're saying if that's his reasoning if later on he does take me out to a nice dinner we have this conversation don't worry about later on first of all you know that this man chops out he goes for
01:52:21
Jakethe filet Min and he tells her to wear a nice nice red dress and they go out and they hit the town your turn comes around and it's macers but I think and he says I'm going to make sure you're not a gold
01:52:31
Shaydigger I think where this differs is um are you saying this if this man knows that you've had these um white night stands you've slept around and he doesn't want to pursue you that's
01:52:42
Jakecompletely okay I don't think but no no no like stick stick to the question for a second sure would you be okay with that situation and then him saying to you I'm not taking you because I want to make sure you're not a gold digger yeah
01:52:55
Jakedid he make sure that everyone else is not a gold digger but he didn't want to he didn't want to Pur past well that's what we're saying we're saying like if the compar don't you think there'd be a double standard though if if he said to you look um first date we're going to ma
01:53:09
Shayis just want to make sure you're not a gold digger but then you're thinking to yourself but you took everyone else to the fil M I think it would be a double standard if he didn't plan to see me again this same way you don't know what he's thinking though this is just
01:53:22
Shayobjective looking at it straight up there's five ducks in a row one of them is black sure but you can't make that comparison when this whole conversation has been that we're that the what differs between a relationship and when