Charlie Kirk Debate: Charlie Compared To ADOLF H?! ALL Girls RAGE QUIT?! (FERAL) | Dating Talk #260

Date: 2025-09-15

Duration: 7h 37m

Guests

Brian Atlas

PPamela (Violatrix)>

SShantel (WNBA)>

Identified Speakers

SPEAKER_02Pamela (Violatrix)(guest)

SPEAKER_03Olive(guest)

SPEAKER_04Javon(guest)

SPEAKER_05Ally (Snow)(guest)

SPEAKER_06Shantel (WNBA)(guest)

SPEAKER_08Brian Atlas(host)

SPEAKER_10Harper(guest)

SPEAKER_11Lola (DT44)(guest)

SPEAKER_13Kiana(guest)

Key Moments

IntroBrian opens with Charlie Kirk tribute

IntroAll 8 guests introduce themselves. Shantel: 6'6", WNBA 2003-2009, abstinent 12 years.

Key MomentPamela reveals mafia-connected father deported her daughter's biological father

ControversyLola invokes Hitler comparison to ask about threshold of justified rejoicing at Kirk's death

Key Moment'What is a woman?' debate. Shantel provides WNBA perspective on trans athletes.

ControversyShantel says Kirk's DEI 'brain capacity' comments were racist

Key MomentBrian admits he is agnostic despite ~80% Christian audience — refuses to grift religious identity

ControversyBeauty standards debate. Brian reveals he only dates Black women.

OtherShantel rage-quits after viciously targeted viewer roast message

Topics Discussed

Charlie Kirk Tribute

Brian opens with Kirk tribute.

Guest Introductions

All 8 guests introduced. Shantel reveals 6'6", WNBA career.

Charlie Kirk Reactions

Lola invokes Hitler comparison. Shantel says Kirk DEI comments were racist.

What Is a Woman / Trans Sports

Lola: anyone who identifies. Others: adult human female. Trans sports debate with WNBA perspective.

Brian Rant About No-Show Guest

Angry rant about guest who cancelled citing safety concerns.

Colorism and Beauty Standards

Heated debate. Brian reveals he only dates Black women.

AI Photos and Roast Session

AI aging/gender swap. Shantel rage-quits after viewer roast. Pamela leaves for mammogram.

Transcript

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Lola (DT44)be rejoicing death in any sense. I think that when someone has such a profound impact on people emotionally, when someone is actively trying to enact policies that will harm people, that

Lola (DT44)will end people's lives, because abortion does kill. Um, or anti-abortion policies do kill. I >> Oh, you said it right the first time. >> Abortion kills. >> You said it right the first time.

Lola (DT44)>> Anti-abortion policies do kill. And on that note, I think that when people see someone who is affecting their lives in such a heavy way and trying so hard to harm them personally, they obviously are going to have an emotional response to

Oliveit. >> Could I just ask like do you have a better example other than Hitler because Hitler has I know it's very extreme. I just >> it's very extreme to the point because

Lola (DT44)he has Kirk is nothing like of course my opinion isn't saying that they're like in any way similar or on similar levels of like evil or anything like that. I'm

Brian Atlasjust curious why why invoke that because I'm sure we we would acknowledge that um there there is a threshold, right? So is

Brian Atlasyour position like let's just cut to the chase. Is your position that Charlie Kirk was beyond the threshold of justified rejoicing in his death because

Lola (DT44)of his political beliefs or whatever? >> I personally do believe so. I I can I don't think that it's rational. I don't think it's reasonable. I don't think it's humane, but I think that if someone

Lola (DT44)has an emotional response like that, it the way or what he had done would evoke emotional responses like that from people whether or not it's Yeah.

Brian Atlas>> Well, I I think there's a couple different thresholds here. So I can look I I think if there's a person

Brian Atlaswho you hate and they die you know maybe they have a personal feeling perhaps this is the social media

Brian Atlasworld we live in. Um even then I I would sort of object to a even a private individual internal rejoice rejoicing

Brian Atlaswhen when someone dies. I do think that that is a bit malevolent and evil, but um to publish it is like a a much higher threshold to

Brian Atlaspublish it >> and to just be so uh I can't even >> like some it's not just I'm glad this happened then like I've seen clips of

Brian Atlaspeople saying why stop there. What about I saw this this girl who was uh she was saying she was saying that it should have been the wife and kids too. >> Yep. >> That's disgusting. I think that is

Brian Atlasdisgusting. >> But I guess my question here is um >> you mentioned the slippery slope. So what then like

Brian AtlasI guess you would be if we were to change like the political alignment let's say and you know I was trying to think like who on the left side or the Democrat side would be on Charlie Kirk's

Brian Atlaslevel. I don't actually think there's a lot of left-leaning influencers that are on his level. I mean >> like if I was thinking like maybe not

Brian Atlaseven Hassan is not on uh Kirk's level. You know who Hassan Tiker is? >> Yes. And just to be clear, don't don't think anybody should, but I was thinking if

Brian Atlaslike somebody on the other side of the political aisle was assassinated, >> like would you also go to the defense of say like Republicans or conservatives

Brian Atlaswho are publicly rejoicing and saying like despicable statements because like from their perspective like logically wouldn't it follow that well

Lola (DT44)because of the disagreements on politics that they're justified and rejoicing. >> Well, see, here's where it gets complicated cuz I don't think that people have a right to rejoice over disagreements. Like, right. I don't

Lola (DT44)think that people necessarily are rejoicing over Charlie Kirk's death because they disagreed with him. I think it's because he genuinely was proposing policies that were harming people. He was actively advocating for things that were Yes. >> No. No.

Brian Atlas>> Go on. >> Well, so you get my point. >> But you're saying harm, right? But from your perspective, right? >> Exactly. But but from from the other perspective, they would say, "Well,

Brian Atlasthese pro-choicers, >> if their okay, the the pro-choice position is that this is murder." >> Mhm. >> When you get an abortion, you're murdering an unborn child. So, from

Brian Atlastheir perspective, that's harm being done. So from their perspective, you must I know you don't agree with that, but you would have to I guess to

Brian Atlaslogically be be consistent if you're I mean otherwise I guess you could just say well I don't agree with their worldview therefore they're not justified in their you know rejoicing in

Brian Atlaslike a left-wing politician or you know whoever speaker political activist being assassinated. But if their worldview is genuinely that abortion is murder, >> like you it would be fair then for them to rejoice.

Lola (DT44)>> Yes. >> So, okay, they should be fine with like abortion clinics being >> No. From my personal perspective, obviously I don't understand it. I can't put myself in that headsp space because that's not what I view it as. If someone

Lola (DT44)genuinely believes that babies are being murdered and they assassinate someone to stop that from happening, I can understand people being happy about that. If they genuinely believe babies are being murdered, I don't. So, I can't

Brian Atlasget into that headsp space. I can't get behind it. But with such a strong emotion like that, I I get it. >> But but so I can I can tell you this. There there are political positions on the left. I lean more conservative,

Brian Atlasright? I'm not like full-blown conservative, but I lean like mostly pretty strongly conservative. There are people who I have fundamental disagreements with on politics and so

Brian Atlasforth. And there are some positions that I think are really harm that left left-leaning positions, leftist positions, liberal positions, uh,

Brian AtlasDemocrat positions that are really harmful to society. They cause harm. But because somebody advocated for these positions or voted for whatever it is,

Brian Atlaseven if a political opponent of mine was assassinated, I would never rejoice. I would condemn and disavow anybody on my side who did

Brian Atlasrejoice, even if this person was a political opponent, a very strong one. That's kind of the difference here >> is I don't think even though there's differences of political opinion, I

Lola (DT44)don't want to see it happening on my side. I don't want to see it happening on the other side. >> Yeah, I am uh I I have one thing to say on that and I want to bring the attention more over here cuz I've been leaving you waiting. Um

Lola (DT44)>> yeah, >> I personally I'm on the same page. I'm not about to go and rejoice over anyone's death no matter what. Um especially because I think when it comes

Lola (DT44)to gun violence uh to rejoice in any death from gun violence is to rejoice in gun violence. Um and I think that that is disgusting. I think that's gun vi

Lola (DT44)violence is completely avoidable. Um and one of the like uh just it it is should be condemned in all manners. On that

Lola (DT44)note, I do think that there is a do you do you believe that there is like a threshold of evil you can cross to where it's warranted for people to have a reaction such as the reaction they're having to Charlie Kirk? Whether or not

Brian Atlasyou think he was there or not, do you think that that level can be reached? >> Yeah, I think that there are genuinely people who are monsters and uh yes, but I don't believe Charlie Kirk passed that

Brian Atlasthreshold. >> Okay, I I can understand that. Like for example, you you brought up you invoked Hitler for I I mean okay >> a bit extreme I understand but

Brian Atlas>> yeah but I mean like this so uh Hitler participate like there were war crimes >> war crimes he comes

Brian Atlas>> but but when you're you're engaged in and conducting uh war crimes then the

Brian Atlasultimate punishment for that would be death. So point out so like and we were this is wartime too. This is a belligerent nation. The United States

Brian Atlaswas opposed to the Axis powers. So and Hitler was the leader of Germany. So yeah, typically when you're you're having an actual physical war with

Brian Atlassomebody, you're trying to actually like take out the leadership. Yes. So there would there there's actually like legal justification, wartime justification for attempting to kill like commanders,

Brian Atlasleaders of the the opposing military because you're at war in this case. However, I guess my question to you would be um has Charlie Kirk committed

Brian Atlasan act that the state would be able to commit capital punishment against him for any of his conduct? >> No. Oh, and I but >> so Hitler as a belligerent against the

Brian AtlasUnited States did commit certain acts during wartime that would warrant capital punishment. >> Yes. My question here when when bringing

Lola (DT44)that up is not to pose um like why is Hitler deserving and um Charlie Kirk isn't. I'm not posing that question. I understand the difference there. The question I am posing is are there

Lola (DT44)circumstances in which it's warranted? regardless of what the circumstances are. I'm just wondering if that's a threshold you can reach, which you've said yes. >> But so why then but so why then can't I say well the threshold for

Lola (DT44)murder or assassinating somebody is because they hurt my feelings. >> Uh a personal belief like that it's up to you. >> My feelings got hurt. >> See, I think that's absurd. But people hold their own individual beliefs. The threshold lies where it lies for each

Lola (DT44)individual. We can't affect that. >> Or what about somebody um I don't know. Somebody called me stupid. >> Sure. Yeah. That's insane. But we I think >> not legally uh the same like anyone can murder anyone. We are really drastically

Lola (DT44)overlooking the point that people are killing being killed being killed with guns specifically constantly in this country obsessively. And we only really care when it's a public face like this because it's fun to cause outrage. I

Lola (DT44)guess people love to argue, right? I think that frankly the most upsetting part of the entire Charlie Kirk situation is the fact that people care so much more when it's his life than it

Lola (DT44)is with anyone else's. >> He was murdered live on television. That's a huge difference in what you're just saying. >> One of his kids too and his wife.

Lola (DT44)>> And I I understand I would like to ask if I can bring can I discuss Palestine here or should I not bring that up? >> Um I mean I'm kind of okay with it. I

Pamela (Violatrix)one one I know you want to come in. I >> I keep interrupting. >> Well, so um >> who's coming to this group for our

Pamela (Violatrix)political opinion? Like how do we go from dating to this group's political shut up? It is it is a pretty big breaking news

SPEAKER_12thing. Well, no. I I agree with Charlie Kirk, but our our deep political philos couldn't tell. I can't shut up. So, >> well, look, we're not going to It's a fair point. We We will get back to dating soon, but I did at least want to

Brian Atlasbring it up because we'll talk about it briefly, but we will move on soon. Um, you wanted to bring up Palestine. >> The one thing I would like to say on Palestine, I understand that there's a difference between it being a

Lola (DT44)broadcasted event with a given crowd, right? Um, people are being murdered in Palestine in front of their entire families, in front of their friends, in front of their communities constantly, more than we are capable of grasping. These videos are being plastered all

Brian Atlasover the internet. It people are watching this [ __ ] for fun. >> Wait, can I can I ask you a question? >> Yes. >> This is going to be this is going to be very sort of roundabout thinking here, but you said that Charlie Kirk espoused hateful rhetoric.

Brian Atlas>> Yes. >> Right. And that Well, I guess you say that that's not justification for assassination. No. But you can understand why people might I don't think that there is any justification.

Brian Atlas>> Okay, never mind. But >> well, okay. So, hateful rhetoric. Um, you said that it would you categorize you mentioned LGBTQ marriage, right? Yes. And how Charlie Kirk opposed it,

Brian Atlasright? >> My question to you is you cited this as a reason for why you might understand why people are rejoicing at Charlie Kirk's death because he was anti-LGBTQ.

Brian AtlasWould you say he's homophobic? Uh, again, I I truly am not that well versed on his specific takes. >> Well, he's against gay marriage. So, would you consider that? >> I would consider that to be homophobic. >> So, you would hold on. You would label

Brian Atlashim as a homophobe. You would label him as anti-LGBTQ. You would say that he he's against gay marriage, etc., etc., and you that was one of the primary justifications for

Brian Atlasyou saying, "Well, I understand why people are rejoicing." You brought up Palestinians. Do you think uh there are there's a good

Brian Atlasrecord of uh h how do I want to frame this properly? >> Oh, I'm excited. >> Do you think in Palestine or other Muslim majority countries that there's robust

Brian Atlasuh laws that protect people who are gay? >> No. Do you think that for example in certain Muslim countries, Muslim majority

Lola (DT44)countries that there uh often times if somebody's found out to be gay that they're stoned to death >> or that's a bit extreme that there are circumstances but we're if we're acting

Brian Atlaslike that is the like natural practice. >> Do you think they're pro-choice? >> But but hold on. Do you think again but you you would you would have to agree the reality is in these m Muslim

Brian Atlasmajority countries uh there's not a lot of rights for uh the LGBT community. >> Sure. If you want >> so wait but why I'm how do you reconcile

Brian Atlasthen? How do you reconcile your defense of Palestine which is clearly anti-LGBT but also seem to have some issue with Charlie Kirk's anti-LGBT

Lola (DT44)position? Well, I mean, first of all, I'm antiviolence in any sense. That comes before any of my other beliefs. I don't think homophobia is a reason to kill people. I, you know, I think that's pretty simple. Um, but I also want to

Lola (DT44)make it clear when I'm talking about Palestine, I'm not talking about the lawmakers. I'm talking about the children. I'm talking about the mothers, the fathers, the wives, the husbands, the men, the women, all of them. >> Well, hold on. Even the citizenry you

Brian Atlasyou do realize in it's not just the politicians in these Islamic or Muslim countries it's the majority of the citizenry is quite anti-LGBT in these

Lola (DT44)>> yes they live in a country where they are encouraged to be I think that we specifically the US is relatively open and uh you know accepting of different

Lola (DT44)people because it's legal here because it's you know we discuss it. We can be in those spaces. We can have community like that. If they're in not able to do those things, then yeah, I'd assume the

Lola (DT44)population is more homophobic. That's fair. I also want to put it out there. I don't justify violence in any circumstance. >> Can I ask you? Yes. So just to be clear, I think my personal position any of

Brian Atlasthese conflicts going on in the world, whether it's Israel, Palestine, whether it's Ukraine, Russia, or whether it's a political individual political assassinations, >> I'm not War is terrible. >> Yes,

Brian Atlas>> I hate to see anybody, whether I agree with them, disagree with them, being killed, uh, civilians being killed, whatever it is, I don't like to see conflict. I don't It's It's terrible,

Brian Atlasright? I guess my confusion is though if it is the case that Palestinians overwhelmingly are anti-LGBT

Brian Atlasthen I and pe if people are rejoicing because they're being killed would you have objections to that? >> They are children. We're talking I if people want to rejoice >> fine. What about the adults?

Lola (DT44)>> The adults. If people are if people are happy that you know um people who are raised to be homophobic are dying and who never really you know knew much else

Lola (DT44)and who were raised in like a genocide, right? Um and whatever like never formed full political opinions. If you want to judge their morality based off of that,

Lola (DT44)go for it. I personally care much more about the fact that this culture is being erased, that the land is being taken, that like beyond count that just an insane amount of people are dying and

Lola (DT44)this is never discussed. It's like it's discussed in the sense of some people online are like this is bad and then with the exception of that people forget for years at a time. >> Uh I would I would really like to bring

Kianait to you. >> Yeah, go ahead. Yeah, I'm pretty much done with my points. Okay. So I you said something very valuable when you talked about we

Kianadetermine how much value a person's life is based on certain things and whose life whose death is more impactful than that. I totally get agree with that and

KianaI'm going to come back to that. But we I feel like we also have this difference in value for human life because you talk about the children in

KianaPalestine. We talk about having so much gun control because the children in all of these mass shootings. What is the difference between children that are

Kianabeing aborted? >> Said what I said or what I wanted to say. >> That's the question I'm going to pose. >> Yes. But I just think that we have this like selective outrage because

KianaI've seen some horrendous videos on social media lately from like clinics of just baby parts in buckets and it's it's absolutely ridiculous. But when it's a

Kianachild sitting in a school, it's somehow different. And that's what's the concern. And I think that's the big thing with Charlie Kirk is that there's

Kianathis value placed on life based on what color you are, based on what your political beliefs are, based on how much money you have. >> And there's this like this double standard. Going back to earlier, there

Kianawas this double standard and we don't have the same energy for all of the different things. So what would you say the difference is or even let's say people who um didn't have an issue with

Kianathe assass oh didn't have the issue with the assassination of I think it was like democratic I don't know what their exact position was but it was a couple I believe I don't know much about it. >> Yes.

Kiana>> People don't have the same upset about that that they have had about Mr. Kirk. So it's what's the explanation for that? Why are we as humans

Kianaputting this like level of like, okay, this is different death or this is different violence or this is different when this these children and it's different when it's these children, like why do you think that is? And and as someone who I assume is proabortion.

Kiana>> Yes. >> I'm I'm pro-choice. >> So, what's the difference between >> the children in Palestine, children in schools, or children being taken? Because either way, they're young lives. I I do completely understand where

Lola (DT44)you're coming from with that. I personally um am not going to get onto the argument of whether or not abortion is murder. That is not my abortion take. Uh the reason that I am pro >> say that taking a life >> is murder.

Brian Atlas>> Well, let me explain my take real quick and then I'll Yeah, we'll get into that. >> You know what? I'm actually going to jump in here just because >> it is getting a little bit away from the actual topic at hand because now we're

SPEAKER_00just getting into like a separate abortion conversation >> which we've already kind of derailed a little bit too much as it is. I have some chats coming through. >> Hail and well met. >> Lol. Paladins donated $2002.

SPEAKER_00>> Yo, where you been? >> She's so into it's sad. The men, the women, and the children of Palestine want death to bunnies and death to homosexuals. It's not just a few bad apples. Unless

Brian Atlasshe thinks the same about police. >> So, it change that was supposed to be Jews. It changed for some reason. Streamlabs changed >> Jews to bunnies. >> I was very confused about the bunny. I

SPEAKER_00was like, I I haven't heard this before. >> Lol. Paladins donated $200. >> Yo, thank you, man. Where you been, bro? >> That being said, it's so hilarious. She is concerned about the Palestinian culture being erased, but yet she would

Lola (DT44)rejoice about her own culture being replaced in the United States. I >> I'm not going to I don't have a response to that one. All I would like to say is I find this very funny because I am

Lola (DT44)Syrian. So I I don't know what we mean by my own culture. I don't support cultural erasure in any form. So maybe Lil Paladins, I don't know if you want to revise it. By the way, thank

Brian Atlasyou for the big support, man. It's been a while, dude. Thank you for tuning in, man. I haven't seen you in a while. Uh, hope you've been well, man. Um, okay. Uh, anybody else wanted to weigh. Did you want to weigh in on the Charlie Kirk thing?

Pamela (Violatrix)>> Anybody? >> No. >> You know what? That's not fair. What happened in our house when I found when we found out that Charlie Kirk died? >> Guys, you guys the mic, please. >> What happened in our house when I found out Charlie Kirk died? Tell them exactly

Javonwhat happened. >> I cried for 3 days. She was in a state for like three days because what happened was was genuinely horrible. It It was horrible. >> It was absolutely horrible. And there's no buts or ants to that. What happened

Javonwas absolutely terrible. And there's there's no other comments to make >> cuz I don't believe that death should ever be a political discussion unless you know we're actively that person is

Javontaking the lives of other people such as Hitler which isn't even you know that's not even you can't even compare the two. Yes. But >> come on. >> In but in um terms of like death isn't

Pamela (Violatrix)political. What happened >> [ __ ] sucked. And that's it. Doesn't matter what you believe. >> You and your sister could not share my I mean your sister was empathetic more so than you. >> Well, my sister doesn't really care

Javonabout anything. I I fear like we could go into war and she still wouldn't care. >> Well, the bottom line is our house was quite divided. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Okay. Uh yeah. Um,

Brian Atlaslet me see if Oh, final thing here. This is something that I wanted to circle back to, then we'll get hopefully into some more dating topics. Um, I have to

Brian Atlasfollow I have to follow up on this. Um, you said woman not a real thing. >> Oh, here we go. >> Um, so I think it might be helpful here.

Brian AtlasWhy don't we just What is a woman? >> Um, a woman is someone who personally identifies as one. A woman is someone who identifies as a woman. Wait, guys, do me a favor here.

Brian Atlas>> I'm going to fix your mics one more time. Leave them where they are. Move your mic to the very edge of the table, please. >> All right. Scoot your mic that way, please. >> A little less. And just keep it at the

Brian Atlasedge. Okay. So, uh, a woman is someone who identifies as a woman. Yes. >> Okay. Here, we'll go around the table. What's your definition >> of a woman? >> Yeah. What's a woman? What is a woman?

Javon>> I believe that [Music] I'm a little bit I'm I'm self-conlicted. I can't lie. Um I believe that a woman is is someone who has reproductive

Javon>> I believe that a woman is someone who has reproductive organs. And I believe, you know, sharing the struggles that women have went through, that is what defines a woman. >> All right. What about you? >> One of two genders in the homo homo

Ally (Snow)sapiens species. Okay. What about you? >> Um, oh, you caught me off guard here. >> Um, just focus on the convo. Don't be

Brian Atlas>> a female is a female and a male is male. That's it. >> A female is a female. >> A woman is a female. >> Yes. >> Okay. What about you?

Olive>> Um, to me, um, a woman could be a mother. It could be truly anyone. But like a woman, she to me it's a mother.

Shantel (WNBA)>> Well, >> well, >> not all women have children. >> Well, children I don't I don't really know. Like >> Okay. What about you? What is a woman? >> Uh a woman is one of two genders. You're

Shantel (WNBA)either born male or you're born female. And if you're born female, you're a woman. >> Okay. What about you? >> Yeah. A woman is one of two genders. A female. She has a uterus and gives birth. >> Okay.

Brian Atlas>> To human being. >> All right. What about you? >> Um I would say the same as the last two. >> Okay. Um I think a woman is an adult human female. So a woman is just

Lola (DT44)somebody who identifi So if I identified as a woman right now, I would be a woman. >> Uh I think that if it was true to yourself, if you genuinely believed that, sure. I think that if you right

Lola (DT44)now were to say it in order to try and make a point, you know, none of us know your intentions truthfully internally. So I if someone identifies as a woman, I'll always treat them as such because I would much rather I mean the amount of

Lola (DT44)LGBTQ people, but specifically transgender people who have mental health issues, who face discrimination, who kill themselves is uh you know so disproportionate from straight people. And I uh personally would never run that

Lola (DT44)risk. If someone tells me they're a woman, then I am treating them as such. If if that's not true to themsel, then it is their morality on the line. It is their like it is, you know, they're the ones betraying themselves.

Brian Atlas>> So, we should affirm people's identity. >> Yes. >> Okay. So, my uh my identity happens to be and it would cause severe mental harm

Brian Atlasto me if you denied my identity. Uh I believe I'm the right person on this issue. Like I believe I'm correct. I would like you to affirm my identity as the correct person on this issue.

Lola (DT44)>> Would you mind if we could quickly define identity because I think we have different definitions. >> The way in I mean just the way in which I identify. What's your definition though? >> An identity is something uh fundamental to who you are. A building block of your

Brian Atlascharacter, not your stance on an argument. >> Well, this is fundamental to who I am that I'm correct on >> your stance on this argument. >> My Yeah, it's fundamental to who I am

Brian Atlasthat I am correct on every single thing I say. Nobody, nobody else can uh defy this. I am 100% right on every single thing and I would like you to affirm my identity as the correct person on this

Lola (DT44)issue and all issues. >> We clearly have different understandings of what an identity is and that's all right. >> What do you mean? I that's how I identify as the correct person. >> See, it's it's a fun argument to make

Lola (DT44)because, you know, it makes transgender people sound so insane when you compare them to something like that. But that's not the claim that they're making. No one is sitting there, you know, taking extremes like that and just trying to like be unreasonable. People just

Lola (DT44)identify with different genders. >> You're saying we should do this because if we don't do this, it would harm them. >> No, I'm saying that, you know, if if it Well, I personally, the way that I like to go through my life, and I'm not saying anyone else has to live like

Lola (DT44)this, but if something isn't causing harm to me or anyone else, and it makes that person feel comfortable, I am always going to align with it. >> Well, how about this? All conservative people feel very strongly about their political positions. >> Yes. And I believe that is harming other

Brian Atlaspeople. >> Well, hold on. But it causes harm to conservative people when people disagree with their identity as a conservative person and they don't they don't get their political will. Laws are passed

Brian Atlasthat are in contravention of their desires and their wants. And sometimes it it creates economic harm. It creates it can even you know going against certain political wills of conservative

Brian Atlaspeople will you know you allow certain say uh you're not going to like this argument but allowing unfettered illegal immigration like not all not all illegal immigrants are violent criminals but

Brian Atlassome of them are and this will allow people into the country who will either like essay sexually assault women uh or you know just kill people whether man

Brian Atlaswoman female whatever uh this does create harm and you not uh you not affirming my identity as correct for example on the immigration issue actually causes palpable harm and I

Brian Atlaswould like you to align with my political ideology. >> I see where your misunderstanding is. My goal is not my goal is not harm reduction. >> I would like you to affirm my position and my political identity as it relates to illegal immigration because I believe

Lola (DT44)illegal immigration causes harm. >> Yes. My goal here is not to make you feel comfortable at all costs. As I said in my initial claim, >> it causes me harm. Sure, that's fine. In my initial claim, >> causing harm is okay.

Lola (DT44)>> In my initial claim, if someone's identity is explicitly not causing harm to me or others, as I said, then I will affirm it because it doesn't matter. That in my opinion is causing harm. So, I will not affirm it for your sake. I

Brian Atlasdon't >> Okay, so hold on. But in all circumstances, must we affirm somebody's like uh if somebody's transgender, must we affirm? >> Well, as I said, I don't think everyone needs to go through life the way that I do. I personally will because I

Brian Atlas>> Can I ask you if it causes harm to the transgender individual to bar them from playing in women's sports? >> Oh, I was waiting for it. >> Well, it it I think it's fair to say

Brian Atlasthat transgender individuals can experience that same level of of harm if we bar them from participating in women's sports. Should we allow them to participate in women's sports?

Lola (DT44)>> Well, I personally think we should. >> Okay. But you do acknowledge the differences in physical strength between men and women. >> I also acknowledge the difference in physical strength by person to person. Every single person has some kind of

Lola (DT44)genetic disadvantage or advantage for different sports and we have never cared before until it comes to being able to discriminate. >> Right? But if it was the case, for

Brian Atlasexample, that transgender women are leaps and bounds more physically like just completely physically stronger. You don't think if it was the case, let's say there was a

Brian Atlasmassive representation of transgender women in sports. And I know look, transgender people, small proportion of the population, so of course they're never going to be like a majority of

Brian Atlaswomen women playing in women's sports. >> Wouldn't it be fair uh or do you think it would be unfair if it happened to end up eventually being the case that

Brian Atlastransgender women took first, second, third place across all of women's sports? You don't think there would that wouldn't raise in your head like any sort of red flag as to like an completely unfair disadvantage? >> Maybe it would, but that's not what's

Lola (DT44)happening because estrogen does make like estrogen supplements that women that trans women take does make them weaker. >> So, just to be clear, you think the only difference between males and females is the Oh, shoot. >> Testosterone.

Brian Atlas>> No, no, no. It's the endocrine system. M >> you think the only all it takes to become a woman is to make a chemically to do a chemical change to your endocrine system.

Lola (DT44)>> That is a big leap from what I said and I did not make that claim. >> Well, you said estrogen. >> Well, as I estrogen does make trans women weaker. So, as they are taking those supplements, it is not like a man competing against a woman. It is not the same.

Brian Atlas>> Well, it's still a male competing against a female. But so you think that there's no verifiable differences in strength? >> I did not say that either. We're jumping to extremes. >> Well, you're saying you're referencing

Lola (DT44)estrogen. Yes. So So okay, then it is your position that trans women >> still maintain mass male strength. I guess >> to some extent. My argument here is No, my argument here is do trans women have

Brian Atlasan advantage in certain sports? Keep in mind strength is not always the only like deciding. Not necessarily. You do realize that men out compete women in every single sport there is the

Brian Atlasonly one there's I believe one specific one specific long-distance event >> where the skiing one >> huh >> the skiing one where they look kind of silly. Is that what we're talking about?

Brian Atlas>> No, there's there's a longd distance running event where women just slightly will out edge men. one long. So women apparently have like some advantage in

Brian Atlasone specific event. If you look at all Olympic events, you look at, you know, fighting, she's a boxer, for example. Uh women just can't compete with men. >> Um so on that note, I would like to say

Lola (DT44)there are gymnastics skills that men can't even compete in that they don't compete in the Olympics or gymnastic skills that women don't even compete in because they are tailored to their strengths. So, I mean, like to say that

Brian Atlasa trans woman would dominate in women's gymnastics is absurd. They would not. It would they would have a huge disadvantage. >> I'm gonna go ahead and grant that there are like certain certain gymnastics things that like women do, men do. For example, I don't know what the move is.

Brian AtlasI don't know if anybody's familiar with gymnastics. like the one where men do the the cross or >> there are things called or whatever like women just don't have the physical capacity even like train gymnasts to do

Brian Atlaslike certain upper body maneuvers that men uh male gymnasts can do. So, but I'll go ahead and grant that yes, how about like the other 99% of uh athletic

Lola (DT44)endeavors where men completely would dominate women if they were to compete together? >> Okay, I'd like to pose a question. Um, could I ask? No, answer my question first then pose your question. >> Okay. My response to that is every

Lola (DT44)single individual has different genetic advantages and disadvantage. Some more extreme than others. I do it has never been in conversation before. It has never been a question of who naturally has the biggest lung capacity in swimming because we can't measure things

Lola (DT44)like that. And it's not >> Well, okay. Sure. We Yes, that's actually a great point. Okay, we can. No, I mean individual to individual. Can we determine Michael Phelps's uh lung capacity compared to a different Olympian and then claim whether or not

Lola (DT44)he was born with an advantage or not? Those things have never mattered before. We've never posed those questions because we understand that humans are biologically always going to be different and have different strengths and weaknesses. It only becomes a problem when people don't want

Brian Atlastransgender people competing. >> But men are physically stronger than women and men have certain physiological characteristics that make them better athletes. >> Sure. And certain men are able to gain muscle easier because of their genetics

Brian Atlasthan other men. >> Yes, some some men have. But my argument would be when you're looking at elite athletes, the best male athletes will always predominate over the best uh

Brian Atlasfemale athletes. Like you have a woman who used to play in the WNBA. If LeBron James played in the WNBA, he could probably [ __ ] smoke play solo against the WNBA and [ __ ] smoke him.

Lola (DT44)>> Yeah, this is the question I would actually like to pose. Um, in the WNBA, I'm assuming that you were competing with women who weren't all your exact height. Can we make that assumption? Yeah. >> Um, do you know like generally the lower

Shantel (WNBA)end of that scale? >> Um, this is Give me a guess. It's okay. >> This is irrelevant, but probably like 56 to 68.

Lola (DT44)>> If you were to do a 1v one match with a 56 woman, do you think that you would have a genetic advantage? Um, maybe maybe not in some ways because

Shantel (WNBA)she probably would be quicker in some ways, but that is not she's going to be quicker in some ways, but that's not that's not the question. The question is

Shantel (WNBA)I'm a 66 female, right? I have been the best of the best at every level since high school. >> When I was the best of the best in high school, what did I do? I went down to

Shantel (WNBA)the wreck and I played against average guys. Why? because they were stronger than me. They were faster than me. They were bigger than me, but they could compete against me. Even though I was

Shantel (WNBA)the best of the best, they were average guys. The best of the best women's B college basketball teams, they compete against average guys. They practice against average guys. Why? Because the

Shantel (WNBA)guys make us better. Same with the pros. We compete against, not pro guys, average guys. Why? Because they're stronger, faster, and they make us better. So, one thing related to that.

Brian AtlasSo, if she was competing against a 5'8 professional male NBA player, that even though she's you're 6'6, that 5'8 player would probably beat her. I mean, look, basketball is a basketball's a team

Brian Atlasgame, but like in a one-on-one. So, currently I I just Googled this. The short shortest player currently in the NW N excuse me, NWA. That's a [ __ ] What the [ __ ] NB excuse me, I'm I'm thinking about rap

Brian Atlasfor some reason. The shortest player currently in the NBA is Yuki Kawa Mura of the Memphis Grizzlies. He's 5'8. He would

Brian Atlas>> He would beat like she's retired, right? He would beat the probably the best female NBA player. I don't care how tall she is. Men and women are just built different.

Brian Atlas>> Like men and women. And you know, we see this in not just the NBA. We see this in soccer for example or football in Europe. They will take the women's national team here, the US professional

Brian Atlaswomen's team. This is the high the most elite best women's soccer players. They will compete against under 15 boy teams.

Brian AtlasLike so the best under 15. They will lose shut out like 8 to zero. The the boys will beat the professional adult women.

Brian Atlas>> We see this in all kinds of sports. Men are just they're stronger. They have and it's just it's physiological. >> Yes. I've never denied that. >> Right. >> My question here is why is that where we

Shantel (WNBA)draw the line? No one has ever cared about genetic advantages before. It has never been a question before >> because it's across the board with men and women. We're talking about men and

Shantel (WNBA)women. It's across the board. Men are at a much higher threshold of strength. But here here's we can let's take sports off the table for a quick second because you made a claim that doesn't another claim

Shantel (WNBA)that doesn't make any sense to me and you're saying it doesn't hurt anybody. How do you know it doesn't hurt anybody them being um us affirming their

Shantel (WNBA)identity? I'll give you a quick story. I travel a lot for work. I went through and you know how in the airport uh women get searched from women with by women,

Shantel (WNBA)men get searched by men, right? So I go through the alarm, I alarm my pants alarm and so they need to, you know, touch me in the private areas. Now the

Shantel (WNBA)woman who comes to search me is very clearly a man was very clearly born a man who put on a wig and some lipstick.

Shantel (WNBA)Right? So, this woman is coming to search me in my private areas. What did quote unquote she ask me? Would you like me to do it out here or take you back

Shantel (WNBA)there? Cuz that's what they do when they have to search you in the private areas. In that moment, I had a choice. I had to decide, okay, I see this person as a

Shantel (WNBA)man. She he really sees himself as a woman. It's very obvious what he was born as. As someone who has experienced sexual

Shantel (WNBA)assault in the past, I know that allowing myself to be pat down in this area by a physical man is probably going to trigger something. But I have to

Shantel (WNBA)decide, okay, so am I allowed for myself to be touched in this way by a physical man or am I going to say no thank you?

Shantel (WNBA)realizing that that means that I'm not affirming whoever he thinks he is and potentially causing some type of mental

Shantel (WNBA)disturbance. His rights whose whose rights are more important, his rights or my rights to be to be frisked by a woman? >> Sure. Now, I I completely understand

Lola (DT44)where you're coming from. I would like to make it clear my initial point that I have now restated a couple times is so long as it does not cause harm to yourself or others, I believe that I would like to affirm people that is a

Lola (DT44)situation where it explicitly does cause harm to you. People have trauma from things. People can't control their traumatic reactions regardless. Even if you did believe that she was a woman, then it still could cause something because you're aware that she was born a

Lola (DT44)man, right? And you are completely within your right to ask for someone else. There is nothing wrong with that. It's not about affirming their gender. I do however think that when you're telling the story, it's very unnecessary to get like just rude about it. When you

Lola (DT44)say that, you know, he's a man who put on a wig and lipstick, you're more than welcome. You are more than welcome to not refer to her as a woman. It's it's none of my business. People hold their own opinions. However, I think to intentionally throw in comments that

Kianacause no purpose other than to be hateful is at that point just rude, just negative. Wait, can I ask >> hateful and now she's hateful because she's >> Can I ask something?

Shantel (WNBA)>> He's literally Hold on. He's literally He was literally a man who put on a wig and lipstick. That's fact. Just so you know, that's a fact.

Shantel (WNBA)He was born a man, put on a wig and lipstick, and decided to call himself a woman. And because of that, I'm supposed to let him go in between my legs and in front of >> I explicitly said that you should ask

Shantel (WNBA)for someone else. >> Right. You said I could ask for somebody else, but in his mind and in his employer's mind, it was okay because he's now a woman. >> And you're able to ask for someone else.

Lola (DT44)>> But I wasn't being hateful. I was saying fact. But now you're calling me hateful because I seated a fact. >> I am saying that after you have explicitly made it clear that she was a trans woman. You've said that you don't believe that she's a real woman. That's

Lola (DT44)all fair. that is none of my business. But the statement that you made, it didn't convey any information. It didn't progress the story. It didn't prove a point. It was purely put in there to offend someone. >> So now you're assuming my intention of why >> what other purpose did that statement

Shantel (WNBA)serve? >> You were assuming my intention. >> Can I ask you your intention then? So I'm not assuming what was >> to describe this person. >> You already had very well >> to in your opinion. In your opinion, I

Shantel (WNBA)described him very well. But you cannot assume my intention as why I put in that detail of that story. >> Okay. >> And so for you to say, "Oh, well, we

Shantel (WNBA)should affirm." That's the problem is that whose rights come first? Who's right? Because he you just told me I was hateful for not affirming him. And to say that he was wearing I'm sorry to say

Shantel (WNBA)that he was wearing a wig and some lipstick. You just said I was hateful. So, >> okay, >> what is to stop him from saying that because I don't affirm his choice to be

Shantel (WNBA)a woman and ask for someone else, what is to stand in the way of him saying then I am hateful >> about that in that way >> he is more than she is more than welcome to have whatever opinions she would like about you

Lola (DT44)>> said again same as the abortion you said >> at the end of the day everyone is going to have whatever opinions they want about you and that cannot rule your own self-perception the same way in the same way that you don't believe she's she's a woman, it should not rule her self-perception, right? You are more

Lola (DT44)than entitled to your own opinion. I'm not telling you you have to affirm her gender. That's not what I said. My claim was just that unnecessary rude comments. It's not We don't need to do it. But I think that you are more than welcome to not view her as a woman. It's none of my

SPEAKER_00business. >> Lol. Paladins donated $200. >> Yo, sorry for the delay on this. >> I'll revise. >> Sorry for the delay. >> Put on your hijab and stop socializing with men outside of your family if you

SPEAKER_00want to identify as Syrian. You enjoy your Starbucks pink drink just like every other basic blonde joyful.

SPEAKER_12>> Now that's a rude comment. >> We can agree on that one. >> Sat effect I don't think is a real is a rude comment. But that that was kind of rude. >> Okay, we can we can do a compromise there. >> Donated $200.

SPEAKER_00>> Sorry for the delays, guys. >> Ladies, are you really going to sit there and let a woman compare Charlie Kirk to Hitler? Step up. defend human decency. Charlie was a good and honorable man regardless if you agreed with him or not.

Brian Atlas>> I would >> I think some of the girls did kind of scoff at the Charlie the Hitler comparison for Charlie Kirk, but um >> I mean we just moved on. I have I have >> I'm sorry. I would very quickly like to

Lola (DT44)just say um >> as frustrating as it is getting to repeat myself constantly, I did start that argument by saying explicitly, I am not comparing the two and that is not my

Lola (DT44)intention. I really don't want to have to keep saying the same things. >> But why did you invoke it if you weren't trying to draw some sort of comparison? again as I've as I have already explained >> came up first once more

Lola (DT44)>> as I have already explained I think three times now the question was brought up so that I could understand if you believed that there is a threshold of evil someone can reach to justify assassination that was why I was curious

Lola (DT44)>> which you were using to say that Charlie Kirk crosses into the threshold of justified assassination >> no I was wondering cuz the thing is if you would argue no there is no threshold then there's no point in that discussion I would understand where you're coming

Lola (DT44)from on that and I would understand that we can't come to terms there, right? Because I think that there is a threshold, right? But we agreed on it. So then that led into a different conversation. It was not in order to make a point. It wasn't to make a claim

Brian Atlason Kirk's immorality. It didn't serve any of those purposes. So, but I I guess my confusion there isn't it just granted and a given that I mean perhaps it's worthy of an

Brian Atlasinquiry, but what isn't it just kind of like basic common knowledge that most people would say yes there is a threshold like for example uh need I ask

Lola (DT44)you do you think most people enjoy breathing air >> okay >> like is that even a question worthy as like >> what we have to understand is the conversation beforehand and was leading to a place where I became unsure if we

Lola (DT44)were agreeing on that point. And if we had disagreed, that's okay. I just was becoming unsure of your stance on it. And I >> Well, there are people monstrous enough that yes, uh there there is

Brian Atlasjustification for killing them. >> Okay. Yes. Some people would disagree with that, believe it or not. >> Like for example, here's a threshold self-defense. If somebody's trying to kill you, you can kill them.

Brian Atlas>> Yes. >> There. And then in wartime, Yeah. that the whole concept of war is we try to kill your soldiers, your leaders, you try to kill our soldiers. Like that

Brian Atlasthat's the basis of war. You're Charlie Kirk is a civilian. He's not a soldier. >> I understand >> it's not wartime. He's a citizen of the United States.

Brian AtlasSo drawing this comparison of well, okay, if there's a belligerent outside nation and army, it's completely incomparable. Now, if you were to tell me like you could ask me, Brian, is

Brian Atlasthere anyone in the United States who you think uh h I'm trying to think if there's anyone in the Well, obviously there's certain people who are like on death row and

Brian Atlasthey've committed like provably committed atro atroc atrocious >> atrocities atro. Sorry, I'm getting tongue tied here. >> But even then, I'm actually in some ways

Brian AtlasI'm actually kind of I do object to some degree uh to the death penalty. Um, so I have objections there, but I mean these are very different things when uh my my objection to the death

Brian Atlaspenalty, even though there are some people who, you know, conceivably do deserve to be put to death for the crimes they've provably committed. My concern with the death penalty is

Brian Atlasthere are people who have been wrongly convicted of crimes. There are people who have been put to death who did not commit the crime. And so I think under that basis, like look, if you put

Brian Atlassomeone in prison, obviously it's terrible if they didn't actually commit the crime. They're wrongfully convicted. Terrible. But at

Brian Atlasleast we can we can free them. You know, we can come back from that. Death is is final. So if we put someone to death who didn't

Brian Atlascommit the crime, there's no coming back from that. That is a major injustice. So that's my justification for being against the death penalty. But again, it's not wartime. Charlie Kirk is a

Brian Atlascitizen of the United States. He's not a soldier. He's not even a politician. He has ma well, he had massive amounts of political influence. Anyways, here I need to I need to shift it back because we've been talking about

Brian Atlasabout some of the stuff too long. We got to we got to talk to some of the other panelists here. We have some chats coming through though. Sharky Mc Sharkface, stop saying pro-choice. That implies you support everyone's freedom to make

Brian Atlaschoices about anything in general, such as getting abortions, vaxes, guns. It's just pro-abortion, not pro-choice. Uh, okay. Well, I think it's fair when

Brian Atlasyou're having these conversations to use the term that the the other side or the side how they want

Brian Atlasto be referenced as. So in this case, pro-choice people want to be referred to as pro-choice. Pro-life people want to

Brian Atlasbe called pro-life. So I don't think it's fair to do this bias thing where, okay, well, you're pro murdering babies, and I'm not. You know, it's like you

Brian Atlashave to you have to be charitable and grant the title or the label or whatever. Otherwise, the other side would just say, well, you're not pro-life. you're um pro-restricting women's bodies or whatever some [ __ ]

Brian Atlaslike that. So, you got to be charitable to both sides. Uh okay, we have Charles Sterling. It never mattered before because we never had men trying to compete compete in women's sports or going into women's bathrooms in the

Brian Atlaspast. Also, by the way, the men's division is open. It's not the if you're a woman and you want to compete with men, there's actually nothing barring

Brian Atlaswomen competing from men. It's just the reality that they can't. >> Okay. >> They can't. >> If women aren't choosing to compete against men, I'm not going to tell them to. You you do acknowledge though if

Brian Atlaswe're looking at world records, gold medalists in the Olympics for example in for examp

Brian Atlasuh in races sprint for example men who don't even qualify to run in the Olympics would get gold medals if they competed against women.

Brian Atlas>> I cannot imagine that is true. I understand they have genetic advantages. You know the website I'm talking about. Oh, Nick's on it. So, uh, this is track and field and swimming. There's other stuff, too.

Brian Atlas>> So, >> this is boysverwomen.com. >> Yeah. So, male high, this is comparing just male high school athletes verse female Olympians. So, these are elite

Brian Atlaslevel women versus top high school athletes. Uh, if boys win against the fastest women, is it fair for males to compete in

Brian Atlasfemale only athletics? So, you see the columns there, boys, women. >> Those are all the medals that high school boys would steal from women if those high school boys

Brian Atlas>> based on. >> Why aren't you ch like histogram of placing? >> Wait, wait. It's not just based on like conjecture and random like thoughts. I'm genuinely asking what is this space for? >> So, do you know when you do Okay, really simple. You know when you do a race and

Brian Atlasthey have a timer? >> Yes. >> And they keep a record. Hold on. There's literally it's not just like vibes and feel good feelgoods. >> Yes.

Brian Atlas>> They keep robust records of >> race times. So, they hit they hit the stopwatch. >> Yes, >> I understand how stop. >> So, you realize time is an objective measurement.

Lola (DT44)>> Yeah. So, is this all just to say that they're faster? This is all to say that that's based on their time. >> Faster, they're stronger. >> Well, no, I understand. I'm I'm saying my answer to the question is just that it's based on their running times. >> Correct.

Shantel (WNBA)>> There's also higher hurdles for men. There's also bigger balls for them, longer fields, bigger courts. Like, >> I feel the need to reiterate. Let's just say that we separated populations in the

Lola (DT44)way that we separate men and women by people who have super long legs and people who don't. Do you think one of those groups can jump higher? Yes, probably. Right. And they probably shouldn't compete in the same division,

Shantel (WNBA)but we're not separating people based off of that, even if they have a huge advantage. >> We actually do. We separate them by grade level. We separate them by age. We separate them by weight class. Exactly. >> So, are you trying to tell me? I'm

Shantel (WNBA)sorry. Are you trying to tell me that that means say, "Oh, I don't know the Olympic scoring." You know how prideful it is to actually argue with a pro alete about this who spent their entire life.

Lola (DT44)>> She played in the WNBA. >> Yes, I understand. But I don't think that that gives her total and complete jurisdiction over genetic disadvantages and advantages. >> She lived firstirhand anecdotal experience and she said that she played

Lola (DT44)against men. >> She also made the claim that a 5'6 man would beat her in a game which I don't think he would. I've put I've played many men

Brian Atlas>> and he might not, >> but that man is an average man and I am far from an average woman. >> Let's frame it like this question for you. I I think so.

Brian Atlas>> Can we be >> One sec. She would she guys Okay, what you want to talk about [ __ ] [ __ ] horrors and [ __ ] Whatever. This is an interest This is more interesting. So

Brian Atlasanyways, to your point, I think she could beat some men who are 5'8. Absolutely she could. >> She could beat plenty.

Brian Atlas>> But here's the question. She was an elite level WNBA player. Could she beat a 5'8 NBA player? The answer to that is

Shantel (WNBA)no. And I would you agree with that? >> Yes, I would agree with that. And I would also agree that yes, I as an elite

Shantel (WNBA)athlete, I am going to beat some average men and have. But is your average 5'8 woman going to beat your average 5'8

Shantel (WNBA)man? No. It is going to take a higher level of woman as far as athleticism. Like Serena Williams is going to go to

Shantel (WNBA)your average tennis court and beat every man there. But she's Serena Williams. >> Like your average woman is not gonna do that.

Brian Atlas>> Also, so yeah. And she's she's one of if one of the best female players, but if she was ranked among the men, she and she admitted this herself, Serena, I was

Brian Atlasit Venus or I don't know which one. The two sisters, she would rank like 400 if she was ranking with the men. She said, "Oh yeah, I would maybe rank in the 400s." Then why aren't trans people

Lola (DT44)dominating? Trans people are competing and they are not dominating. >> Wait, there's there are examples of trans people dominating. >> There are examples of trans people winning that. Many trans people are losing. The trans people in sports who

Javonare not dominating at their sport aren't being spoken about because they aren't used as ammunition. >> I'm letting her final thought for her. Then I got to move it on. I got to get I got Go ahead. >> Um so I am definitely more leftleaning in my ideologies, but I do have to

Javonagree. Um, I have been boxing since I was fighting around since I was around 9 years old. And one time I sparred my fiance and uh, it went on for about 45 minutes and I was bedridden for about

Javontwo weeks and my technique there's nothing fl of course there's flaws within my technique. But regarding fighting, I am a better fighter and he beat my ass and he had only like one

Javonyear of boxing experience. So, like men do have the upper hand. Like biological males absolutely do have the upper hand within sparring and sports in general.

JavonAnd I feel that maybe we should not be mixing the two biologically because I do feel as a fighter myself and an athlete, >> it's not fair. I I

Brian Atlas>> also for combat sports like her, it's not just somebody else wins the medal. She goes up against a trans woman, but that person could still reasonably have

Brian Atlaslike the physiology perhaps a slightly weakened state of the physiology of a male. She's getting broken orbital bones. She's literally going, it's literally harming certain combat athletes if you allow them to compete against a man.

Lola (DT44)>> Uh, two things I would like to say on that. I am not going to speak on combat sports because I think that that is purely strength-based. And when it's purely strength-based, I'm not going to claim that I like obviously people still have genetic advantages and disadvantages.

Lola (DT44)>> Faster, like just forget strength. >> Sure. Combat sports, I'm not making a claim on whether or not what's going on there. But I would also like to say I would hope obviously I've never boxed. I don't know how boxing works, but my

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